Sebenza

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ALLHSS said:
On a separate but related note, the Axis lock also faces a similar issue in that the lock relies on the spring holding the lock bar on the tang of the blade. Because the lock bar is cylindrical and the tang is angled, under enough pressure it will simply overcome the spring and friction pressure and unlock. Still a good lock, just not as apt for these lock strength tests. As demonstrated by Benchmade's tests, they still face weight tests without shock and at slower speeds because those tests ensure more friction (that's why the locks deform the liners rather than unlocking).
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Interesting but Demko always makes sure he releases the pallet jack very slowly so I'm not sure the Axis lock would pop out like you suggest in one of his tests.
 
palonej said:
Hey Brett!
Wanna try out some bad a$$ M4.....check out the exclusive BM 908 at KSF!!
Awesome knife that I've had for about a month.
Little pricey, but worth every penny!!
Joe
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Thanks Joe. That is actually the one I had in mind. :thumbup:

Maybe Christmas money if I get any this year. :D
 
Hmmm... knives break... all of them if used outside their limits....

If I want a strong one I use a heavy duty fixed blade... if I want an easy slicing one I use a thin ground one.... If I'm putting a lot of force on any knife, (over 20 lbs), then generally I suspect its either dull or I'm using it wrong. :D

Haven't seen the test, don't own a sebenza, and probably never will... Doesn't change the applicability of the above.

***EDIT*** I just watched the video. The obvious and inherent flaws in the methodology are so rampant and varied as to be pointless to try and catalog them all... And once the knife had been whacked with the rotator and forced past its point of function, the other test is with an obviously damaged knife. So those results also have no meaning.
There is no significance other than the tester has an obvious bias. There is a reason for independent and unbiased testing being a requirement for science. **** Der....

Oh and the invalidity of the video testing doesn't change the validity of the prior commentary I wrote.
 
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ALLHSS said:
So at this point, if you insist on arguing that Cold Steel has changed their rhetoric to reflect the belief that the RAO is stronger then you are just plain incorrect.
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Sorry. I wasn't ignoring you. I simply assumed you were paying attention.

Please refer to post #243 above and then tell me why you think Cold Steel found it necessary to revise the wording in both the KC and osogrande descriptions of the 4-MAX relative to its lock strength.
 
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I don't believe the video. There are many ways that test can be rigged. Just brainstorm on it for awhile. Any testing by a competitor using machines and test criteria designed to destroy a knife not made in the same manner as the manufacturer of the "standard knife" is BS.

Even if the testing was honest, there is an innate bias in having the tester be the manufacturer of one of the knives being tested. If Cold Steel or Demko really cared about this type of testing or if they really cared about an excellent marketing position, they would have hired an independent engineering firm to do the testing. But hey, then they might fail. :) Outside of the Blade cutting competition, there are no "independent" testing, and even those competitions are unfair comparisons since the same person does not test each knife.

Cold steel makes a great product and so does CRK. I own folding knives from both brands and neither has failed to perform in any way. So in the end is the test relevant??
 
bld522 said:
Then how do you explain the revised wording in both the KC and osogrande descriptions of the 4-MAX? You did notice that the description relating to the 4-MAX's lock strength was changed, right?
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This over-built beast is without a doubt the strongest knife we have ever produced and we're willing to bet that right now, it's the strongest 4" folding knife in the world!

thats still on the cold steel website^^

http://www.coldsteel.com/Product/62RM/4-Max.aspx
 
It sure is. Now read that same sentence in the KC and osogrande descriptions of the 4-MAX and tell me what you see. If you see what I see, Cold Steel isn't willing to make that bet anymore. What do you think made them change their minds?
 
im not saying your wrong about that but both are independant dealers were you not saying that it was reworded because the rao lock? If so obviously cold steel has no problem saying it still and they are the ones that have a dog in the fight not two dealers. If not I just misunderstood what you were going for there.
 
What I'm saying is that the likelihood two independent dealers could have come up with exactly the same wording to describe a knife is remote.
 
AmosPaul said:
If I forked out the money for a Sebenza I doubt I would use it very hard.
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What's your definition of hard? Prying open a window? Prying between two floorboards to provide a bit of clearance to get a dedicated prytool in? Cutting 5" service firehose? Taking out car windows? Running your knife across a garage floor cutting industrial line markers with silica glass through it? Might not be hard by your definition, but it's not slicing paper...
 
Those sound like the kinds of tasks I'd probably use something besides a folder to accomplish.
 
bld522 said:
Sorry. I wasn't ignoring you. I simply assumed you were paying attention.

Please refer to post #243 above and then tell me why you think Cold Steel found it necessary to revise the wording in both the KC and osogrande descriptions of the 4-MAX relative to its lock strength.
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Cold Steel didn't revise anything. Those retailers did. As I said, look through any dealer's descriptions and you'll find factual errors. They often write the descriptions on their own, borrowing from the manufacturer and other dealers.


bld522 said:
It sure is. Now read that same sentence in the KC and osogrande descriptions of the 4-MAX and tell me what you see. If you see what I see, Cold Steel isn't willing to make that bet anymore. What do you think made them change their minds?
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Read my above statement. You are making things up, to the point of obsession.

bld522 said:
What I'm saying is that the likelihood two independent dealers could have come up with exactly the same wording to describe a knife is remote.
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Cold Steel changed nothing. Their official site still has the original wording. If you are arguing that two dealers' descriptions hold more validity than the description on the official website then you are wrong, and again harping on a point that holds no reason outside of obsession.
 
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Rapt_up said:
***EDIT*** I just watched the video. The obvious and inherent flaws in the methodology are so rampant and varied as to be pointless to try and catalog them all... And once the knife had been whacked with the rotator and forced past its point of function, the other test is with an obviously damaged knife. So those results also have no meaning.
There is no significance other than the tester has an obvious bias. There is a reason for independent and unbiased testing being a requirement for science. **** Der....
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You seem to have missed the part where he took a second, brand new knife after the whacked knife failed and tested it as well.
 
fetzer85 said:
Interesting but Demko always makes sure he releases the pallet jack very slowly so I'm not sure the Axis lock would pop out like you suggest in one of his tests.
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I agree. That's why the Axis lock would do pretty well in his tests, but not as well as in the Benchmade tests. If you watch the Benchmade tests they speed them up because the force is applied over a VERY long time.
 
ALLHSS said:
Cold Steel didn't revise anything. Those retailers did. As I said, look through any dealer's descriptions and you'll find factual errors. They often write the descriptions on their own, borrowing from the manufacturer and other dealers.




Read my above statement. You are making things up, to the point of obsessive delusion.



Cold Steel changed nothing. Their official site still has the original wording. If you are arguing that two dealers' descriptions hold more validity than the description on the official website then you are wrong, and again harping on a point that holds no reason outside of obsession.
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I agree with this. What does it matter ive looked at a bunch of dealers and alot have different things. For what your saying the only real wording that should matter is the official wording on their own website, if they had changed that it would make sense. They dont control what dealers put they do control whats on their own website.
 
evilgreg said:
You seem to have missed the part where he took a second, brand new knife after the whacked knife failed and tested it as well.
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Yup didn't watch to the end... No point testing method is meaningless Further given they modify the knife right out of the box it's not 'brand new'. Like I said the flaws in the testing are so numerous as to be laughable.

If a junior engineer working for me proposed testing like this I'd make him list every flaw, and then show me how he could redesign it to fix them all. Then I'd make him do it all. And repeat every test he'd done with the new process to show how much difference it made... All on his own time....
 
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