"sole authorship" - from a collectors point of view

I understand that I'm probably a dinosaur in a lot of ways. Don, I thought you were a machinist. I'm all the more impressed that you aren't. I have no quarrel with the new ways, if that's what they are, but i just sometimes have a problem trying to figure it all out.

The reality, I guess, has already been agreed on: however you do it, just let the customer know so the customer can decide whether our work is worth his money. Honesty and total integrity go a long way in all walks of life. This one is the same way.

I did forget to mention my 25 ton press and the air hammer and rolling mill in the works. Can't be a complete dinosaur. My body won't take all that hard stuff anymore. We all adjust and do things more efficiently and to preserve what's left of our skeletal system.

Things have progressed rather rapidly since I got into this 16 years ago. We have to learn some of the high tech, I guess, or go the way of the dinosaur. I just love making knives better than I like learning more things to do with a computer. And I'd rather spend the large sums of money that some equipment costs on my wife. That's a better investment in the long run.

This has been an interesting thread, with certain exceptions. It's nice to see so many different aspects of the craft through so many different eyes.

Gene
 
Here is a general observation and question. When the 4 founders set up the ABS, the purpose was to preserve the art of the forged blade. The Guild has a similar mission in that it promotes the art of handmade knives, be they stock removal or forged. We are all involved in an field of endeavor where we arguably make an archaic product and, if we are doing it mostly by hand, in a most archaic fashion. Sure the raw materials are better or at least more consistent in quality, but if you look at what we are doing compared the guys in Sheffield in the 1850's or even the guys in places like Italy and Spain in the era right before firearms were widely introduced in the 1400's, it is not that much different except for our energy sources. Instead of wood, coal, wind and water power, most of us, the neo-tribal guys excepted, are using electricity and/or gas. Where is that line between being an artist/craftsman and being in some form of business producing a product. It has gotten a bit blurry of late. It has never been easy to make a living or even make a little money as an artist. It seems to have gotten a bit complicated in our particular art, particularly if you want to remain true to the old ways.
 
John R. Fraps said:
.."sole of the maker heart of the fire" is a marketing term...nothing more...If you believe otherwise, get awake fool!
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As far as I know, when I wrote :
Allan Molstad said:
The hand-made forged blade is more than just tool, it's a story of history, it's a connection to the very heart of the fire and the soul of the maker.
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I did so only to share how I felt about the work of all bladesmiths. I didn't mean to market anything.
But if thats the way it seems, then I need to pick my words with more care.
Im sure not here selling anything, Im just talking about what I think is a good way to look at this topic

As for what my sentence means?
Allan Molstad said:
The hand-made forged blade is more than just tool,.
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What I mean by this; is that I respect the work of all the bladesmiths, and blacksmiths, and silversmiths, etc, who bang on metal in the darkened rooms. I understand that the same person could have just got in the car and drove to the lumber yard and got a tool or item for cheap that he just spent an hour making, and thats why I believe that you have to see past the final result to understand their actions. You have to see the path taken to get to the final result to understand the answer to the question; "Why do it?"

Allan Molstad said:
it's a story of history, .
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By this I mean that: That there is no good reason for going to the trouble to forge a blade. There is no good reason to own a forge. There is no good reason that I can think of why I would need to go outside in the middle of the winter , or on the hotest days of the summer and be banging on a red-hot chunk of steel....other than this is how it was done in the past, and in my own limited way, I am working to hang on to a way of life thats past into history.

Allan Molstad said:
it's a connection to the very heart of the fire and the soul of the maker.
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There is something that I think is very basic to an open fire in the story of mankind. And the fire of the forge is able to unite people of the 21 century with ideas and ways of doing things that came from a history of doing things that all used to be based on the open flame.

And the reason why a guy would care about things in the past?
The reason to go to all this trouble with darken rooms, loud tools, smelly coal, dangerious gas, and snotty remarks from others who think the bladesmith is a "fool"?
My answer is "and the soul of the maker", and by this I mean that perhaps there is no one answer to the "why?" questions, due to the fact that each person is always going to be so different.
The heart of one person and his reasons are never going to line up flush with the reasons of another's.

Now, if there is something you wish to see me talk about, or to explane, or to change my mind about?...then I would need to see what words I have used cause you such spitting-mad, cussing at me concern? Then quote me.

"Hand-made" and "sole-authorship" are terms I did not invent, and I dont remember using "sole-authorship" in real life even once.
I guess some of us can use them to talk about both our own work, and the work of others.
My guess is that there are infact many was to use the terms, some more "offical' in some eyes than others, and I also guess that the same terms mean very little to many other people.

I can only share here what the terms have come to mean to me,
But I understand that not everyone gets it.
Clearly not everything I post on-line is understood or in agreement with some of you.
Not everyone seems to like the way I wrap everything I post in the context of a love of the forge and how much fun I think it is to forge a knife in a more traditional manner.
Traditional ways of doing things mean a lot to me, they dont mean a lot to everyone.
It's a lot like watching some of the video clips I find on YouTube such as http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gmX7MTApc64&mode=related&search= and I try to share them with others, only to find that some of my friends think they speak to our hearts of both our past and our futures, and other of my friends dont see the point in people spending time doing such things at all .

...
 
Allan Molstad said:
.....
Now, if there is something you wish to see me talk about, or to explane, or to change my mind about?...then I would need to see what words I have used cause you such spitting-mad, cussing at me concern? Then quote me.
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Here you go, AllanMolstad/AlanMolstad/DaQo'tah, I'll quote you. This is from your profile in your former screen name as "DaQo'tah Forge":

Favorite Knife:
Ed Fowler - Pronghorn
Biography:
I dont give a rip what you think of me, I know I am right ....also, I enjoy ticking-off people that dare to disagree with me....
Location:
ND
Interests:
I make a few knives in the long winter, I study the Katana, I am in Kendo, I also do a little preaching to help save the world from sin,,, (need I say more?)
Occupation:
I have the winter off due to the cold where I live, however I work like a dog the rest of the year...

Now, given that you displayed that kind of arrogance and disrespect for everyone here in one of your past profiles, how much credibilty do you think we should give you? How much of what you write here is just so much BS designed to cause trouble so you can sit back and gloat at the upset you cause? How much of your faux-innocent, "Oh, this is just how I feel" line are we supposed to take as real and how much as intentional troublemaking for your own fun.

You see, because of stuff like that profile, I can't help but think you are continuously trying to stir the sh*t, that almost everything you say is meant for wicked purpose. If you can tell us how to be able to distinguish the wicked parts from the sincere statements then perhaps we'll not go off on you, and a good man like John Fraps won't have to say what he did.

So, tell me why I should consider you anything more than a troublemaker. I figured out months ago that you were DaQo'tah, because you left a trail whether you realized or not. Then you were involved in threads where it was twice mentioned, and you didn't respond. Matter of fact, Mark Williams asked you pointedly right here on Shoptalk and you ignored him.

I'd probably still have kept my mouth shut about it, but I am not about to sit idly by while you try and toy with John. I like John.

..........................................................

For those who are newer on Shoptalk, there's definitely "history" here. DaQo'tah made himself personna non grata and acquired sufficient negative reputation points that he was "banned" to Pirates Cove and labeled a "Phuktard" a couple years ago. After a year or so away, he returned as Alan Molstad and then Allan Molstad.

if you want verification of the profile, Advanced Search "DaQo'tah Forge". If you want verification of his identity, do an Advanced Search using "DaQo'tah" in the subject and "Cougar Allen" in the username. You'll find two threads where Cougar identifies him as DaQo'tah. They can track this through IP numbers that are logged, so it's a pretty sure thing. I accept Cougars word.

Then, if you want a little more info, you can Google "DaQo'tah" and "DaQo'tah Forge" and see his two Tripod websites to get some more insight. You might even enjoy the Klingon stuff.

....................................................................

So, there you have it. You folks can think what you want of me, but I'm sick and tired of Molstad playing people. We all know that every so often I decide to be a big AH anyway. I consider this a just cause. I just can't think well of someone who would have a profile like that, nor can I not think that every controversial thing they say is intended to inflame.

Have a nice day.
 
a profile ?
Thats what you have a problem with me about fitzgerald?
I will gladly change any part of a profile, thats no big deal.
I dont care if you disagree with me, but Im not sure you do yet..

Tell me where we disagree?
Is there some point I have writen here that you disagree on?...


Is there some part of anything that I have writen that you think is not true?
 
Allan Molstad said:
a profile ?
Thats what you have a problem with me about fitzgerald?
I will gladly change any part of a profile, thats no big deal.

But...

Is there some part of anything thing that I have writen that you think is not true?
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No, not the profile. The person behind the profile who has a history around here of stirring the chamber pot. Combine the two and I have a serious problem with trusting your intentions.
 
Again...is there something I have writen that you think is wrong?

I wrote 3 major posts on this topic, posts I spent a long time working on to get just right so that they truly reflected the ideas I wanted to make. I tried to write about things I think about while I make a knife, and while I think about all knives and us knifemakers in general.

I posted them for you to read and judge.

If you find them in error, then now would be a good time to quote me the parts of my work you have to disagree with...
Thats how people learn things...
It's like if I made a knife for you. If you got a problem with my design then tell me what you dont like.
But I dont want to get into all this "You are ugly and your mom smells funny" personal crap...
 
I dont give a rip what you think of me, I know I am right ....also, I enjoy ticking-off people that dare to disagree with me....
Click to expand...

I also do a little preaching to help save the world from sin,,, (need I say more?)
Click to expand...

Are you really a preacher? Now, I'm not a chrisitian but these two statements, in my mind, kinda seem to negate each other. Much like the flawed logic and deliberate button-pushing you make evident in many of your posts.



So as not to be entirely off-topic, in my opinion sole authorship is really kind of a silly and moot point. Michelangelo had apprentices that did much of his work for him just as he was originally apprenticed to another. In this way, the artist's skill was passed on and he was given more time to create and let his students paint by the numbers. Even today, I have worked on sculptures that I built by myself but were created by another. I did the work but it was not MY name that went on the piece. I think that is just the way it is in much of the art world.

Knives, I think, are a little different- handmade ones at least. Usually we see collaboration between two equally skilled artists but whose skills are in different areas. To me, this has just as much appeal as in knowing that a knife was created by one maker alone.


And stock removal and forging... I figure its tomatoes and tomahtoes. Done right, the end result of either method is a beautiful knife that does what it should very well.
 
roughedges said:
To me, this has just as much appeal as in knowing that a knife was created by one maker alone.

.
Click to expand...
yes, there is always a place for knives that show the work of many hands.
There are some knife sheaths I would love to own and carry a knife of mine in.
So there is no harm in many people learning to skillfully make only a single part of the over-all knife.

There is also just as much a place at the table for knives that reflect only one set of hands.
A knife that knew only the one maker's work.

The most important thing is that a person has to make sure that the facts are always out in the open about how a blade was made...(except for trade secrets)...Thus we dare not try to pass off the work of others as our own or it will sooner or later rise up and bite us in the butt.
 
BRAVO my good friend Fitz!!!

I couldn't have said it better myself :D

Just like good 'ol "This is Da'Qotah" to dodge the point you made. Some things never change eh?

THANKS MIKE!!!
 
After searching "DaQo'tah Forge" and scanning around on Molstad's (if that is his name) web site, there is something quite odd there. I saw Ed Fowler knock offs being talked about as if they are his own design with no mention or even a hint of inspiration from Fowler. That's just nasty:eek: :mad: :rolleyes:

Allan Molstad said:
...The most important thing is that a person has to make sure that the facts are always out in the open about how a blade was made...(except for trade secrets)...Thus we dare not try to pass off the work of others as our own or it will sooner or later rise up and bite us in the butt.
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You better put something on that nasty bite before it gets infected. :D
 
Mike Fitzgerald, this little bit of info sure explains a lot!

Kerry, I did the search also, very interesting!

Thanks,
 
While my original post was out of line language and exclamation-wise, and prior to reading post #83 and forward, I went back and edited my post....

Mike, you are one of the Good Guys who post on the forums, as are other guys.
I took the bait Allan was fishing with (probably gave him a good laugh at my reaction).....I am not happy with myself that I let that (my taking the bait) happen. ....
Darn it!
 
John, I fully understand why you felt compelled to go back and change your original post. It's called "gentleman", and any rough behavior is typically followed by some self-recrimination. Occasionally,though, even a gentleman can be pushed past his limits. Your response did not exceed a continuing provocation.

I have to say, I'm glad I got to read it in the original. It was pretty good! :thumbup: Still not too bad. ;)
 
fitzo said:
John, I fully understand why you felt compelled to go back and change your original post.
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Part of the beauty of the internet is that a person does not have to post an answer right away.
This is different as compared to a real conversation when the back-and-forth nature of the conversation means you have to say something right away.
The problem with needing to speak right away for some of us is that we might say in anger things that we feel bad about later.

But on the internet I have always felt the best way to go was to never answer back if I was upset.
This keeps a person from needing to go back and change his more heated words to now reflect better on himself.
 
You're a real trip, Molstad. I posted what I did for one simple reason. This morning I watched as you repeatedly edited your post quoting John, serving yourself better and better each time. I watched change after change.

You're a real freakin' hypocrite.

I won't be changing this, you can bet your fool ass on that. :thumbdn:
 
yes, I made it as right as I could...
I wanted it to be just the way I felt it should be...I tried to be carefull, however I see know that my spelling does so suffer still.

But thats that,,,I worked on it a LONG time to get it right...
And I did write a very LONG post.
That post of mine is also a very "busy" post in that I make use of different quotes from 2 totally different parts of this topic, as well as the addition of an address from YOUTUBE at the end...
...
It was not a shot from the hip by any means, but rather is as carefully writen point-by-point going over of one sentence that was called into question as I can do.
I believe that my "quoted' sentence is right on the money, I also believe that when I talked about what I meant by my sentence I did so in a way to be as well understood as I can make it to be.
Looking at it now, I believe it does reflect what I wanted to say....

Then the question I ask you is,,,,What I have writen, do you disagree with it?
Is there a part thats in error?
 
Mr. Molstad, you repeatedly question me and try to engage me as you pointedly refuse to answer any of the questions put to you. That is utter hypocrisy and continues to reduce your credibilty level further. You are already operating well into the red.

Any who were here when you made a complete fool of yourself as DaQo'tah see the exact same thing going on now as you dig yourself an ever-deeper hole. You became personna non grata then, and you are repeating the same mistake.

If you seek answer to where I find you in error, do a search on any of your posts under any of your usernames and start reading. Pick a topic and you will find where you rubbed me and many others the wrong way. The topic regarding "voodoo" in knifemaking is as good as any. It is the thread on which I turned to my wife and said, "I think this is that DaQo'tah bonehead!" Funny how right I was, and history repeats itself.

Say what you will after this post, but I am done with you. My point has been made completely.

Have a nice day. :)
 
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