Tidings and the return of Schatt and Morgan?

Lander boy Matt said:
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(dealer photo)
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jeffsenpai said:
Not sure if I should post here or in the other thread, I will add my thoughts and experiences. I subscribe to the email newsletter of a dealer that specializes in selling traditional pocket knives, and got word of this new Weed & Co. release, and his story about the return of another US manufacturer of quality slipjoints piqued my interest. With the popularity of GEC right now, it certainly is the right time to enter the market. Not surprisingly, the new run of Weed & Co. Folders sold out near instantly when this dealer released them. I missed out. A day or two later, however, I happened to be browsing a misty mountain dealer site, and saw a variety of the Weed & Co. knives in the new arrivals section. I had my choice to purchase. So for $79.99, I bought the red jigged bone trapper.
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I will share my first impressions with the Weed & Co. trapper.

My experience with trappers until this point lies solely with the Chinese made Kissing Crane trappers. I collect the yearly Halloween trappers they typically produce.

On opening the tube, there was no wax paper, the knife arrived in a plastic wrapping. The paperwork inside was thoughtful and appreciated. There was no outer box, just the tube. The tube prominently says MADE IN THE USA with domestic and imported materials.

The bone handles are fitted to the bolsters just fine, no gaps or overlap. The blades arrived sharp, and I suppose if I was nitpicky I could say the grinds on the edges were imperfect, but it wasn't something I even noticed until I inspected the knife very closely. I am glad to say the pull to open the knives is light. I am not a fan of heavy pulls at all. The nice light pulls are very similar to my Kissing Crane trappers. While the dimensions are essentially identical to my Kissing Cranes, the bone handles are thicker. The weight is also heavier, this knife weighs in at 4.06 oz. The Kissing Cranes compare very favorably to this Weed & Co. sample. $29.99 vs $79.99.

When the clip point blade is closed, the backspring is slightly proud of the handle. When the blades are open, then backsprings are flush.

The shield is mostly flat, with a little bit of black gunk in the deeper recesses. You might be able to see this in the photo.

For a product that was somewhat advertised as a test run, I am not dissatisfied with the knife.

What I find interesting here is that I did not really check into bladeforums throughout this purchase process and now catching up and reading threads today, there seems to be an overall negative vibe about the knife and the new brand.
I had no idea that the Weed Shield would be so divisive. I not some druggie, but I never gave it a second thought. I would think that there would be lots of support for a US based company bringing more traditionals to the market.

These seem decent for the price, especially considering we are supporting a US maker. If aftermarket prices go crazy, may as well save up for a GEC instead.
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jeffsenpai jeffsenpai Thank you for posting the photos of your knife! I hope you don't take any of the following the wrong way, I am in no way trying to be critical of you, but rather, just taking a critical look at the knife itself. Personally, I am very interested in seeing the S&M line revived. A couple of questions.... Is there any blade play and are the pulls smooth and snappy?

Judging from the photos, these don't look all that bad, but considering what it is, I get why everyone here is being critical of these knives, especially at the price point. If they really want to compete with GEC, I personally think they need to up their game and the following are things they would have to refine in order to be in the same league.

1: That proud backspring when closed is an instant deal breaker to me. You can get a Rough Rider for $10 without that issue and any knife at $80 better not have that.

2: The sharpening doesn't look so great to me. Even though this is a personal, maybe minor gripe, if you look at the heel of both blades, they aren't straight, but have a slight recurve. To me, that's a sign of an inexperienced sharpener. Also, at the tip of the clip blade, the angle looks like it changes, instead of being fluid and smooth.

3: The spine of the spey blade appears wavy, instead of straight in the photo.

4: The shield inlet is too deep and looks like it would catch your finger in an uncomfortable way, which would drive me nuts.

5: The blade tangs are etched, as opposed to being stamped.

6: The polishing compound (black gunk) should be nearly completely cleaned out. I hate having to take a toothpick and cleaning patch to a brand new knife.

Aesthetically, the pattern, colors, shield and jigging aren't very appealing to me, but remember, when GEC first started, they primarily made 23's and 73's which aren't appealing to me either.

Does anyone know what their identification system is, or if they even have one? That's another collectible factor for me.
 
draggat said:
jeffsenpai jeffsenpai Thank you for posting the photos of your knife! I hope you don't take any of the following the wrong way, I am in no way trying to be critical of you, but rather, just taking a critical look at the knife itself. Personally, I am very interested in seeing the S&M line revived. A couple of questions.... Is there any blade play and are the pulls smooth and snappy?

Judging from the photos, these don't look all that bad, but considering what it is, I get why everyone here is being critical of these knives, especially at the price point. If they really want to compete with GEC, I personally think they need to up their game and the following are things they would have to refine in order to be in the same league.

1: That proud backspring when closed is an instant deal breaker to me. You can get a Rough Rider for $10 without that issue and any knife at $80 better not have that.

2: The sharpening doesn't look so great to me. Even though this is a personal, maybe minor gripe, if you look at the heel of both blades, they aren't straight, but have a slight recurve. To me, that's a sign of an inexperienced sharpener. Also, at the tip of the clip blade, the angle looks like it changes, instead of being fluid and smooth.

3: The spine of the spey blade appears wavy, instead of straight in the photo.

4: The shield inlet is too deep and looks like it would catch your finger in an uncomfortable way, which would drive me nuts.

5: The blade tangs are etched, as opposed to being stamped.

6: The polishing compound (black gunk) should be nearly completely cleaned out. I hate having to take a toothpick and cleaning patch to a brand new knife.

Aesthetically, the pattern, colors, shield and jigging aren't very appealing to me, but remember, when GEC first started, they primarily made 23's and 73's which aren't appealing to me either.

Does anyone know what their identification system is, or if they even have one? That's another collectible factor for me.
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Judging by the pictures from the next release they haven't improved much. Of the 4 I picked up from the first release two had serious issues. You could say they are batting .500 but this ain't baseball. Disappointed with what I am seeing so far from the next release. The novelty has worn off. Doubt they will last long without significant quality improvements or reduced pricing.
 
I got one of the first releases and I really don't think I can cut butter with the edge on it.
 
nickvnlr said:
I don't know about weed or battle axes, but this is a recent photo posted to the S&M Facebook page. They look better, but this is only one angle on two knives. 🤷‍♂️

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That bone is absolutely hideous to me but these both look pretty good to me otherwise. I think I'll let some other people test the waters first.
 
In my opinion, Case's proclivity towards producing garishly dyed bone with gimmicky shields is a serious pitfall for them and unfortunately, I see the same in Cooper's efforts. The lines he was quoted on regarding the development of dyes and hues using primitive methods and natural materials is pretty much rubbish based on the results I have been seeing. Naturally derived dyes are far more muted and less vibrant than the chemically produced alternatives.

That said, there are some positive elements to the above knives. The pictures aren't great but the patterns look ok, the grinds look pretty clean and the inletting of the shields looks decent. Better pictures and more hands-on feedback are warranted for sure.
 
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Well they still don't look anywhere near quality to my eye, and they certainly don't pay homage to former Schatt/Queen knives.

Tang stamp looks weak, blades are stamped out weakly, horrible choice of colour for smooth bone, ridiculous tiny shield out of all proportion to the rest of the knife- maybe they had only little shields left to use up after the lameness of weed and poleaxe? Frankly, it looks like a very early Rough Rider when they were just starting out, but doubtless at a very much higher price.

Most other knives are much better than this stuff, it has an abysmal aura about it all.
 
A large part of my factory collection is Queen/ S & M. I enjoy the different knives and the lure of rare patterns made over the years. I really would like to see them succeed for many reasons. In the knife making industry, including factory knives there is no substitute for experienced crafts people. I don’t see evidence of that fully in their first offering. I am not abandoning the brand, but I (like many others) need to see incremental improvement in many areas. The U. S. Knife Industry is small, but there needs to be targeted recruitment of experienced resources and fast.
 
draggat said:
jeffsenpai jeffsenpai Thank you for posting the photos of your knife! I hope you don't take any of the following the wrong way, I am in no way trying to be critical of you, but rather, just taking a critical look at the knife itself. Personally, I am very interested in seeing the S&M line revived. A couple of questions.... Is there any blade play and are the pulls smooth and snappy?

Judging from the photos, these don't look all that bad, but considering what it is, I get why everyone here is being critical of these knives, especially at the price point. If they really want to compete with GEC, I personally think they need to up their game and the following are things they would have to refine in order to be in the same league.

1: That proud backspring when closed is an instant deal breaker to me. You can get a Rough Rider for $10 without that issue and any knife at $80 better not have that.

2: The sharpening doesn't look so great to me. Even though this is a personal, maybe minor gripe, if you look at the heel of both blades, they aren't straight, but have a slight recurve. To me, that's a sign of an inexperienced sharpener. Also, at the tip of the clip blade, the angle looks like it changes, instead of being fluid and smooth.

3: The spine of the spey blade appears wavy, instead of straight in the photo.

4: The shield inlet is too deep and looks like it would catch your finger in an uncomfortable way, which would drive me nuts.

5: The blade tangs are etched, as opposed to being stamped.

6: The polishing compound (black gunk) should be nearly completely cleaned out. I hate having to take a toothpick and cleaning patch to a brand new knife.

Aesthetically, the pattern, colors, shield and jigging aren't very appealing to me, but remember, when GEC first started, they primarily made 23's and 73's which aren't appealing to me either.

Does anyone know what their identification system is, or if they even have one? That's another collectible factor for me.
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Yes, pretty much what you are saying is right.
The knife blades are sharp, but as you noticed there are flaws with the bevel. I didn't really notice until I looked at the pictures I took.
No play thankfully.
 
nickvnlr said:
I don't know about weed or battle axes, but this is a recent photo posted to the S&M Facebook page. They look better, but this is only one angle on two knives. 🤷‍♂️

bsUabCU.jpg
Click to expand...
I see improvement here, and still have hope that this venture will move in a positive direction. It seems like this guy is putting it all on the line to make a go of it and I wish him the best. He is pushing uphill in a theatre that has had many casualties in the last few decades.
 
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