TYRANT KATANA: MAGNUM OPUS, and BUSH WAKI ANNOUNCEMENT THREAD

[GreX]

Huntsman Knife Co. LLC. - do you have any sketches or renderings of the blade profile? I have been looking at some other Katana style knives, and some have what I'd consider a drop point and others have what I'd consider a tanto point. Just curious where your head is at, I really like the way the tanto versions look, but I'm not a knife maker, and I don't know enough to know what is better for hard use/what you're thinking.

Thanks!

 

[Huntsman Knife Co. LLC.]

Huntsman Knife Co. LLC. - do you have any sketches or renderings of the blade profile? I have been looking at some other Katana style knives, and some have what I'd consider a drop point and others have what I'd consider a tanto point. Just curious where your head is at, I really like the way the tanto versions look, but I'm not a knife maker, and I don't know enough to know what is better for hard use/what you're thinking.

Thanks!

Alright everyone, here's what I'm working with on the Katana. Note, these are just initial drawings and have not been approved by the machinists. These may need to have some elements reworked to be viable for fixturing and production.

I've come up with two concepts.

One is a full tang model. This is the strongest way to make a blade, but because we are limited to 40in on the mill for the actual steel portion of the blade, we are sacrificing quite a bit of cutting edge for a stronger tang which probably is not even needed.

I've done a good amount of research and watched lots of reviews on traditional Katanas. They all historically featured a half length tang with a wooden coffin handle held together by a single bamboo pin. To me this seems incredibly weak, but in testing and according to historical accounts, handles rarely fail, its always the long, thin blade that breaks first. So this got me looking at using a traditional half tang approach but obviously beefing it up a bit with modern materials and engineering.

So that leads me to the half tang model, which has several key benefits.
1. We can cheat and make the blade length much longer, We get about 3.5 more inches of usable cutting edge.
2. We can make the handle longer, and there are no real constraints on the length of the handle. It could be anywhere from 12-13 inches. The one pictured is 12in.
3. Fitup, takedown, and assembly will probably be easier with less tang.

Now for the downsides, the handle is not as strong, but I think, even with Z Tuff, you would be looking at a blade faliure before the handle ever came off or snapped. The rear portion of the handle would be supported by two thick slabs of Terotuff or Micarta which is very durable, and secured to the tang with 2-3 screws.

I think the half tang, well really a 2/3rd tang, is the way to go. More blade, and I think it will look more elegant... now to see if it can be fixtured.

 

[FullMetal]

Alright everyone, here's what I'm working with on the Katana. Note, these are just initial drawings and have not been approved by the machinists. These may need to have some elements reworked to be viable for fixturing and production.

I've come up with two concepts.

One is a full tang model. This is the strongest way to make a blade, but because we are limited to 40in on the mill for the actual steel portion of the blade, we are sacrificing quite a bit of cutting edge for a stronger tang which probably is not even needed.

I've done a good amount of research and watched lots of reviews on traditional Katanas. They all historically featured a half length tang with a wooden coffin handle held together by a single bamboo pin. To me this seems incredibly weak, but in testing and according to historical accounts, handles rarely fail, its always the long, thin blade that breaks first. So this got me looking at using a traditional half tang approach but obviously beefing it up a bit with modern materials and engineering.

So that leads me to the half tang model, which has several key benefits.
1. We can cheat and make the blade length much longer, We get about 3.5 more inches of usable cutting edge.
2. We can make the handle longer, and there are no real constraints on the length of the handle. It could be anywhere from 12-13 inches. The one pictured is 12in.
3. Fitup, takedown, and assembly will probably be easier with less tang.

Now for the downsides, the handle is not as strong, but I think, even with Z Tuff, you would be looking at a blade faliure before the handle ever came off or snapped. The rear portion of the handle would be supported by two thick slabs of Terotuff or Micarta which is very durable, and secured to the tang with 2-3 screws.

I think the half tang, well really a 2/3rd tang, is the way to go. More blade, and I think it will look more elegant... now to see if it can be fixtured.

While both look cool, I personally would prefer the full tang version.

 

[Huntsman Knife Co. LLC.]

And here is what we can do with the half tang. On top is the 13in handle concept which brings the entire sword to a staggering 45in.

 

[CBurgett]

45in overall with 31in blade in ztuff? Yeesh, I’m trying to hold off on buying any new blades this year.. Seriously though, this is looking like it’s going to be quite an awesome blade!

 

[SpyderPhreak]

Wow. Only just seeing this. Dang...

I'm possibly interested in the Katana, but I cannot commit at this time. Dang vehicle repairs!

One comment I'd have, strictly from an engineer's perspective. If the katana is only going to be "rated" for soft targets like fruit, people, or tatami mats, then I think the partial tang design would likely be fine. However, if it's going to be "rated" for hard targets like trees/wood, then I think a partial tang is a bad idea. That long blade generates a lot of inertia, and I could see a potential problem with the back end of the tang having issues with the fastener getting loose, or worst case cracking or breaking the grip material.

 

[Huntsman Knife Co. LLC.]

Wow. Only just seeing this. Dang...

I'm possibly interested in the Katana, but I cannot commit at this time. Dang vehicle repairs!

One comment I'd have, strictly from an engineer's perspective. If the katana is only going to be "rated" for soft targets like fruit, people, or tatami mats, then I think the partial tang design would likely be fine. However, if it's going to be "rated" for hard targets like trees/wood, then I think a partial tang is a bad idea. That long blade generates a lot of inertia, and I could see a potential problem with the back end of the tang having issues with the fastener getting loose, or worst case cracking or breaking the grip material.

The Katana is going to be for "Sword things" even with a full tang, there's no way to make a blade this size thats durable enough for extreme use without making it weigh 5lbs.

The Waki will be aimed for hard use and abuse. Between the shorter blade, full tang, and blade width, it will be able to handle pretty much anything.

 

[SpyderPhreak]

The Katana is going to be for "Sword things" even with a full tang, there's no way to make a blade this size thats durable enough for extreme use without making it weigh 5lbs.

The Waki will be aimed for hard use and abuse. Between the shorter blade, full tang, and blade width, it will be able to handle pretty much anything.

I figured that was probably the case based on your description, but thought I'd throw that out there just in case. Good luck with this project, and I will be watching this space closely...

 

[Moorik]

Alright everyone, here's what I'm working with on the Katana. Note, these are just initial drawings and have not been approved by the machinists. These may need to have some elements reworked to be viable for fixturing and production.

I've come up with two concepts.

One is a full tang model. This is the strongest way to make a blade, but because we are limited to 40in on the mill for the actual steel portion of the blade, we are sacrificing quite a bit of cutting edge for a stronger tang which probably is not even needed.

I've done a good amount of research and watched lots of reviews on traditional Katanas. They all historically featured a half length tang with a wooden coffin handle held together by a single bamboo pin. To me this seems incredibly weak, but in testing and according to historical accounts, handles rarely fail, its always the long, thin blade that breaks first. So this got me looking at using a traditional half tang approach but obviously beefing it up a bit with modern materials and engineering.

So that leads me to the half tang model, which has several key benefits.
1. We can cheat and make the blade length much longer, We get about 3.5 more inches of usable cutting edge.
2. We can make the handle longer, and there are no real constraints on the length of the handle. It could be anywhere from 12-13 inches. The one pictured is 12in.
3. Fitup, takedown, and assembly will probably be easier with less tang.

Now for the downsides, the handle is not as strong, but I think, even with Z Tuff, you would be looking at a blade faliure before the handle ever came off or snapped. The rear portion of the handle would be supported by two thick slabs of Terotuff or Micarta which is very durable, and secured to the tang with 2-3 screws.

I think the half tang, well really a 2/3rd tang, is the way to go. More blade, and I think it will look more elegant... now to see if it can be fixtured.

Here are my thoughts on this:
Purely from intuition, I think it’s better to have a 28-inch blade with a full-tang handle that’s 12 inches long.
I’ve chopped through a lot of wood with blades, and it seems to me that extra inches won’t give us any real advantage.
Also, I believe a full tang will provide better energy distribution.
With a partial tang, when striking wood, trust me, guys, you’ll feel the vibration in your hands.
By the way, if you, Hunter, can somehow manage to make a very solid handle with a full-tang blade—28 inches for the blade and 12 inches for the handle—in real-world conditions, especially when chopping wood or similar tasks, that would be the best option.

This is just my opinion.
I’ve struck wood with many blades, and honestly, a solid full-tang blade always performs better.
The traditional idea of a partial tang, as I see it, comes from the context of people striking each other with blades, not wood—maybe bamboo or tatami at most. Personally, I’m okay with the extra weight in my blade (a full tang always weighs a bit more). But because of that, the energy distribution will be significantly better, and the blade will be more forgiving of mistakes. I’ve used a traditional katana; they’re light and deadly against soft targets, but they practically don’t forgive mistakes when striking even wood. So, I’m all for a 28-inch full-tang blade with a 12-inch handle. A confident two-handed grip, a solid handle that’s thick enough, and a full tang. With the geometry I’m picturing, it’s incredibly cool. I really want it.

 

[Moorik]

You know, I thought about it again.
It’s definitely a sword, like, literally. At this point, it feels like it’s hard to find a balance in the context of “let’s make it even tougher.”
In my opinion, you should do it the way you see it.
Because our idea of “hitting a tree with a 30-inch blade like it’s a chopper” is just a desire to cram everything into one blade.
So, the sword’s “swordiness” and “katana-ness” —
Should we lean more toward a chopper?
Do it the way you envision it.
From the concept:
Functionality > It can kill > Elegance > Balance > And only then durability.
I think it’s up to you to decide!
Do everything as you originally planned, and only after that, if possible, leave room for “user errors” in the blade.
For those of us who want a katana, we need to accept that it’s not a chopper.
P.s
Forum name **Tyrant Katana**:
Sword **Huntsory Huntso**, what do you think?

 

[zaedion]

That's awesome, thank you for sharing the renderings Hunter!

Full tang sounds great! What about something in between? 30" blade 10" full tang handle. With an extended pommel it would probably be 12" total. I find extra handle length doesn't necessarily translate to easier to use, and with large hands, 10" handle seems plenty enough.

That said, I’m with M Moorik , whatever Hunter envisions his Magnum Opus to be, I’m sure it’d be amazing! For a heavy chopper, there’s the Tyrant Waki with the wider blade anyways. Having some elegance, style and zombie slaying prowess in the katana sounds great!

Is the coffin handle pieces and pins going to be epoxied together into one single piece?

I wonder whether having a layer of rubber insert in the coffin handle would help absorb some shock and make the handle less prone to breakage, in case people want to chop down some trees with it

 

[Huntsman Knife Co. LLC.]

And here's what I'm cooking up for the Waki.

I'm trying hard to get two versions made. Unfortunately K kevo711 planted the idea in my head to make a Waki with the full coffin handle like the Katana and now I can't stop thinking about it. Honestly, this might be the blade you guys are looking for. We'll see if I can get both made, but no promises.

Both will be for hard @$$ use and feature a 1.5in tall blade that can take impact and bite DEEP. These are a significant departure from a traditional wakizashi which was a backup blade typically used with one hand. This version is a two handed monstrosity that is meant for abuse and power chopping while retaining speed, lightness and classic Wakizashi aesthetics.

Top Blade: This is the Tyrant Edition with a guard, coffin scales, and pommel. This one might check all the boxes for somebody who wants a fun blade that looks the part, is bomb proof, and chops well. Price point will have to be quite a bit higher because of the complexity, but I do think it will be worth it. This would probably come in at a $1,300 price point.

Bottom Blade: This is the original concept. Full tang, incredibly strong, still light and balanced. I'm seeing if the pommel for the Katana can be shared with this model to improve balance and add some length to the handle.This will have flares at the front of the scales to give a locked in grip with the forward hand and prevent slippage. I'm placing the screw holes in the flares to make the tang maximally strong. If we can make the pommel work, I'm thinking this version could be made right around $900- $950. The pommel adds some cost, but its needed to balance the wider and heavier blade, give the handle extra length, and will create a truly premium feel.

These both have roughly 20in blades and will have a full 11in handle you can swing like a baseball bat.

 

[FullMetal]

And here's what I'm cooking up for the Waki.

I'm trying hard to get two versions made. Unfortunately K kevo711 planted the idea in my head to make a Waki with the full coffin handle like the Katana and now I can't stop thinking about it. Honestly, this might be the blade you guys are looking for. We'll see if I can get both made, but no promises.

Both will be for hard @$$ use and feature a 1.5in tall blade that can take impact and bite DEEP. These are a significant departure from a traditional wakizashi which was a backup blade typically used with one hand. This version is a two handed monstrosity that is meant for abuse and power chopping while retaining speed, lightness and classic Wakizashi aesthetics.

Top Blade: This is the Tyrant Edition with a guard, coffin scales, and pommel. This one might check all the boxes for somebody who wants a fun blade that looks the part, is bomb proof, and chops well. Price point will have to be quite a bit higher because of the complexity, but I do think it will be worth it. This would probably come in at a $1,300 price point.

Bottom Blade: This is the original concept. Full tang, incredibly strong, still light and balanced. I'm seeing if the pommel for the Katana can be shared with this model to improve balance and add some length to the handle.This will have flares at the front of the scales to give a locked in grip with the forward hand and prevent slippage. I'm placing the screw holes in the flares to make the tang maximally strong. If we can make the pommel work, I'm thinking this version could be made right around $900- $950. The pommel adds some cost, but its needed to balance the wider and heavier blade, give the handle extra length, and will create a truly premium feel.

These both have roughly 20in blades and will have a full 11in handle you can swing like a baseball bat.

I am in for both!

 

[zaedion]

They both look amazing! They'd make it Magnum Opus x3!!!

To be honest, I'm REALLY drawn to the simplicity of your original Bush Waki design. I'm curious to know what was the blade width of that design, and whether there might be any chance for a 2-3" wide blade monstrosity that would absolutely destroy everything. One can only dream...

 

[Huntsman Knife Co. LLC.]

They both look amazing! They'd make it Magnum Opus x3!!!

To be honest, I'm REALLY drawn to the simplicity of your original Bush Waki design. I'm curious to know what was the blade width of that design, and whether there might be any chance for a 2-3" wide blade monstrosity that would absolutely destroy everything. One can only dream...

Its 1.5in wide. I'd like to explore a wider version some day but it will be very heavy and will be cost prohibitive. The OG design from 2017 was 2in wide. It would have been a straight up battering ram.

 

[zaedion]

We all know M Moorik is ready for Dragon Slayer sized hunk of steel, so that's totally fine! 2" wide sounds just about right!

 

[SharpBits]

Z-Tuff = sword for sword-like action.
AEB-L = sword-like object for crazy stuff.

 

[Huntsman Knife Co. LLC.]

That's awesome, thank you for sharing the renderings Hunter!

Full tang sounds great! What about something in between? 30" blade 10" full tang handle. With an extended pommel it would probably be 12" total. I find extra handle length doesn't necessarily translate to easier to use, and with large hands, 10" handle seems plenty enough.

That said, I’m with M Moorik , whatever Hunter envisions his Magnum Opus to be, I’m sure it’d be amazing! For a heavy chopper, there’s the Tyrant Waki with the wider blade anyways. Having some elegance, style and zombie slaying prowess in the katana sounds great!

Is the coffin handle pieces and pins going to be epoxied together into one single piece?

I wonder whether having a layer of rubber insert in the coffin handle would help absorb some shock and make the handle less prone to breakage, in case people want to chop down some trees with it

Sorry I forgot to reply to this.

The scales will be held together by torx head corby bolts. I am leaning towards gluing the scales together just to add an extra element of strength and to prevent water or sweat from getting through to the tang, but the whole coffin handle will come off as a single piece for assembly/ disassembly.

I looked into adding a very small strip of rubber, not to absorb shock, but to kind of act as a gasket for fitup, but ultimately I don't think it would be very beneficial.

 

[kevo711]

Wowww!!! Put me down already for a Tyrant Waki and Bush Waki. I feel the Tyrant Waki offers the best value. You can beat on it and it’s elegant, however it is still affordable.

 

[Korangi]

Really like the Tyrant Waki concept. Something pretty but lives up to the Tyrant moniker being overbuilt and bombproof. I wouldn't want to give up function for pretty and traditional, but would happily pay for the space coral carbon fiber handle option...