Warning: Dishonest buyer/seller Morfiuss

Esav Benyamin said:
What are you trying to accomplish with that? Would you like PayPal to decide to investigate Bladeforums transactions generally?

For all the times we try to remind people here to use PayPal correctly, we still get people who cheat themselves out of protection.
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I think paypal should investigate anyone, anybody on any website that screws them out of money. Which is what a whole lot of so called honest people do here. It's wrong. Period.

They are not just cheating themselves out of protection. They are cheating paypal. Actually, they are no better than thieves. You can clean it up all you(not you personally, generally) want but the bottom line is anybody who is paying with paypal, and pays with F@F and the transaction is not a gift, is a thief. Actually, the buyer and seller are stealing. But whatever.


We've been through this, what? 1000 times? I'm not asking Bladeforums to do anything. Just members to act like honest people. I will never, ever, EVER....buy from someone who stipulates F@F. Anyone who does it is nothing better than a mugger, burglar, car thief, horse thief, pickpocket. Yea, pickpocket sounds about right.

Makes me sick. Maybe my morals are just too high.
 
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sirupatespecial said:
I think paypal should investigate anyone, anybody on any website that screws them out of money. Which is what a whole lot of so called honest people do here. It's wrong. Period.

They are not just cheating themselves out of protection. They are cheating paypal. Actually, they are no better than thieves. You can clean it up all you(not you personally, generally) want but the bottom line is anybody who is paying with paypal, and pays with F@F and the transaction is not a gift, is a thief. Actually, the buyer and seller are stealing. But whatever.


We've been through this, what? 1000 times? I'm not asking Bladeforums to do anything. Just members to act like honest people. I will never, ever, EVER....buy from someone who stipulates F@F. Anyone who does it is nothing better than a mugger, burglar, car thief, horse thief, pickpocket. Yea, pickpocket sounds about right.

Makes me sick. Maybe my morals are just too high.
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Can't you see what Esav is saying? If paypal decides to investigate knife sales, here or elsewhere, and realizes the amount of TOS that are being violated in one little insignificant corner of their pocket book, how long do you think they will put up with that. Not worth the headache. Just put knives on the no-no list or something of the like. More attention from paypal is more attention from paypal. Will that be good? Bad? I don't know and I don't want to find out. I use paypal the correct way. Anyone else who doesn't has made their own bed. No need to ruin it for those who use it the right way.
 
Yup^^^
Just what we don't need.
Use common sense and G&S.
Joe


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
HappyDaddy said:
I've said it before and I'll say it again - If BFC would simply make it a violation for a seller to demand or accept F&F payment, it wouldn't stop the practice entirely, but it would deter it, it would be the right thing to do, and would reduce the number of instances where post hoc cleanup is required.
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Moderators don't work for money, but it wouldn't be hard to get more people to moderate the sales forums. Paypal gift is the cause of probably half the scams I've seen. Not making a rule against paypal gift is ridiculous. All the excuses I've seen make no sense. The bottom line is that it probably would reduce the number of people paying for memberships, which would reduce the site's revenue. I've seen a ton of infractions for a particular emoji or language that's not "family friendly", but implementing a rule to stop 50% of the scams? LOL no way!!!
 
I dont understand the necessity of a "rule" against paypal F&F
if you think you'll get scammed, just don't buy from sellers that ask for it..end of story! why do you need someone to enforce it??
If you go with F&F and get scammed, you have only yourself to blame..just let ppl know who the scammer was, and MOVE ON!
Don't be coming here to ask for a "rule" to help you avoid what you could have easily avoided in the first place.
 
Armadew said:
We're adults. We shouldn't need babysitting.
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Very true, The thing every one need to take in to mind is that PP G&S is for purchasing items and PP Gift is that, it is a gift and you are giving some one money for the fact that you can.

If you are buying some thing then buy it and pay the fee so you have some insurance just in case as Murphy's law will always apply.
 
HappyDaddy said:
We've rules out the ying yang, but one that actually protects buyers from unscrupulous sellers is a bridge too far? How hard is it for a mod, when doing whatever perusing of sales threads they do, to warn/infract a seller who's ad demands/allows F&F payment? It wouldn't take long for the practice to fade away, to the benefit of everyone. It isn't about protecting PayPal, it's about having an honest and safe marketplace.

That all I'm saying on the subject.
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Or.. just delete GB&U threads started by people who used F+F to pay. It's been discussed repeatedly on why they shouldn't do it that way, if they choose not to listen or read it's on them completely..
 
I looked at this knife as well being as the seller is in Canada. My thought is that if someone is willing to steal 10 dollars from PayPal on a 300 dollar sale they are probably just itching to steal the whole 300. Stealing is stealing, these guys always find their own level. A thief is a lower form of life and shouldn't be tolerated at the largest knife forum in the world.
 
Leon. said:
I dont understand the necessity of a "rule" against paypal F&F
if you think you'll get scammed, just don't buy from sellers that ask for it..end of story! why do you need someone to enforce it??
If you go with F&F and get scammed, you have only yourself to blame..just let ppl know who the scammer was, and MOVE ON!
Don't be coming here to ask for a "rule" to help you avoid what you could have easily avoided in the first place.
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Exactly! I think time is better spend educating members of the danger of buying with Gift. And encouraging members to read the GB&U threads so they can understand why. Creating more rules and adding more mods to enforce the extra rules seems like overkill.
 
I'm on another large forum (NASIOC) that made it against the rules to use F&F to purchase items in their sales forums. Big sticky at the top of the page. Not a problem for the moderators, there are plenty of rank and file members that are more than happy to point out that F&F is not allowed, pretty much takes care of itself.
 
If I want to cheat PayPal and only accept goods and services that's my business. I pay to sell on blade forums ,if they told me how I could accept money id probably not renew my gold membership to be honest .

Not saying I accept gift payments because I don't I'm saying I paid my dues to sell on here . That's about as good as it gets right there.

If I violated PayPal TOS that's between me and PayPal not bladeforums.

3rd time because I know I'll be accused of taking the gift or f &f . I don't do this not saying it's OK to do this ,I'm saying I paid 30 bucks to sell on blade forums how I get my money is the least of their concern since I bought a membership to sell
 
Spartan00 said:
If I want to cheat PayPal and only accept goods and services that's my business. ...

If I violated PayPal TOS that's between me and PayPal not bladeforums.
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And after the cops, this sub forum. Why should we care if you, or anyone else cheats and robs?
 
RevDevil said:
Best practice is to forget to use the word Mint in anything you are selling. Nothing sets of the bullshit detector like someone selling anything "mint", it more than likely isn't. In the rules it says to give an honest and pessimistic description of the item to avoid issues. It also says to describe your items as they are, don't hype them as something they clearly aren't It can come back and bite you. People generally aren't stupid, they can tell when a knife has been sharpened, they can tell when a knife has been pocketed, they can tell when there are scratches and such that are from the factory and when they are caused by careless "EDC'ing". If people continue lying by omission, and not being forthright, we will have to start infracting people and ultimately closing threads. There is no reason to try and hide the condition of the item or making it seem that it is better than it actually is.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/entry.php/90-How-To-Trade-Knives-and-Gear-Successfully



If you take a knife apart, it is no longer new, much less mint
If you sharpen a knife or tough it up, it is no longer new, much less mint
Bewildering how people go so far out of their way to try and BS others and avoid common sense, just to make a quick buck. If you cannot be honest and upfront, this isn't the right place for you, period. But that is just my take on it.
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If everyone had to do business with a MOD once in awhile I think descriptions would be a lot more honest. If the Mod I did business with wants to speak up they can otherwise it will stay between me and him .

Long story short I had a truly new knife I sold .Talk about going over that knife with a fine tooth comb and looking for anything wrong with it before that sale! Luckily they were happy with it but that's a way to make you extremely honest!
 
Spartan00 said:
That's a little extreme robbing and cheating vs violating a TOS is not in the same league
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You are absolutely right. It's not robbery. It is cheating. When you sign up for PP, you promise to follow the TOS. What's your word worth? Cheat PP out of the tiny fee you promised to pay as the price for the service you want to use?
 
Thomas Linton said:
You are absolutely right. It's not robbery. It is cheating. When you sign up for PP, you promise to follow the TOS. What's your word worth? Cheat PP out of the tiny fee you promised to pay as the price for the service you want to use?
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I don't cheat PayPal , not saying cheating PayPal is right , I'm saying in my posts it's not blade forums job to police that Paypal has their TOS which is already not good with the knife industry anyway .

Blade forums contacting PayPal would just make the relationship with knives even worse IMO.

I'm saying we pay to sell on here ,we follow blade forums rules to sell etc. Infractions given for a 3rd party payment site with no love or affiliation to blade forums is a little over the top
 
People who use this or any other forum in a way that helps to facilitate theft, ie violating Paypals TOS, degrade the status of the forum.

Doesn't matter if you pay "dues" or any other fee in order to sell here or elsewhere. People who willfully steal from their customers and the members of the group using the excuse that they pay for the privilege of selling here or elsewhere bring dishonor to the group at large. Merchants aren't allowed to violate rules or laws administered by a third party simply because they pay rent for a storefront. Paying for a dealer membership here or at any other forum that allows sales isn't a license to behave however one wishes, it's an agreement to reimburse the forum for that members use of it to make
money.
 
I knew My words would get spun that's why I wrote it so many different times .

No a membership is not a means to act any way you want . I agree but the people that abide by blade forums rules has nothing to do with PayPal .

If someone chooses to cheat PayPal that's between then and PayPal . Not saying it's OK to cheat PayPal or act like an ass when doing deals ,I'm saying you pay your money to sell your stuff as long as you follow blade forums rules you should be GTG, PayPal terms of service being enforced by bladeforums?

PayPal over the years has been a headache for knife buyers and sellers ,give them more reason to give us knife people more headaches in sales ? I hope not simple fact is if you don't want to pay the fees PayPal has look elsewhere I have a few ways to get paid online some have fees some don't . It's PayPal job to police themselves not our mods.
 
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