What specs are major turn-offs?

marrenmiller said:
Those mediums were probably chosen as they're all readily available and are slightly different than each other in terms of material stiffness and skin strength. Do you think that a chisel grind would somehow perform better in some other medium than a v-grind?

Keep in mind that, in general, almost everything you cut is an elastic material, and those will show results that align with the test results here.

I haven't owned a Douk Douk, but I bet it performs roughly in line with any other blade that's got a bevel of roughly 3/4" height and a blade stock of .11".
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Carrots, potatoes and beets all are the same to a knife...hard materials that fracture with thick blades. Why do three tests with essentially the same media if not to skew results to a predetermined conclusion? Their test is designed to favor thin knives with v-grinds. In science its called "expectation bias" in experimental design and its a form of fraud or at least lazy thinking or just poor scientific technique

I know from experience that chisel grind knives are not the first choice for those types of things. Per Japanese chefs, chisel grinds are the best knife out of the drawer for some kinds of material. Also my electric paper cutter at work is a chisel grind as is the old tobacco plug cutter at the antique store.

The Douk Douk is a better slicer than the Mercator Cat that has a similar blade, but a different, standard v-grind and secondary bevel.
 
marrenmiller said:
Of what? Cutting just like a comparable v-grind at best?
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I think its supposedly a tougher edge? The thing I cant get my head around is most knife chisel grinds have at least a micro bevel on the opposite side which to me means they are just a severly lopsided v grind? a true chisel has a flat side right? to me the small benefit in edge toughness just doesn't outweigh the detractors of a chisel. I have a set of kitchen knives with chisel ground steak knives and they absolutely suck ass. cant get a straight cut on anything.

I have owned and still have a cpl chisel grind knives. Never enjoyed using any of them. even my Emerson La Griffe annoys me though I still carry it for its flatness and ease of EDC . I have slashed at boxes and other stuff with it to get a feel for actually using it and it always veers off in the same direction on the cuts. with a V grind La griffe I have cuts are always stable and straight. how is that a good thing?
 
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ponykid said:
I think its supposedly a tougher edge? The thing I cant get my head around is most knife chisel grinds have at least a micro bevel on the opposite side which to me means they are just a severly lopsided v grind? a true chisel has a flat side right? to me the small benefit in edge toughness just doesn't outweigh the detractors of a chisel. I have a set of kitchen knives with chisel ground steak knives and they absolutely suck ass. cant get a straight cut on anything.

I have owned and still have a cpl chisel grind knives. Never enjoyed using any of them. even my Emerson La Griffe annoys me though I still carry it for its flatness and ease of EDC . I have slashed at boxes and other stuff with it to get a feel for actually using it and it always veers off in the same direction on the cuts. with a V grind La griffe I have cuts are always stable and straight. how is that a good thing?
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There's no benefit in toughness. It's the same thing as a V-grind, just tilted over at half the inclusive bevel angle. For a given grind height and stock thickness, they're otherwise identical.
 
brownshoe said:
Carrots, potatoes and beets all are the same to a knife...hard materials that fracture with thick blades. Why do three tests with essentially the same media if not to skew results to a predetermined conclusion? Their test is designed to favor thin knives with v-grinds. In science its called "expectation bias" in experimental design and its a form of fraud or at least lazy thinking or just poor scientific technique

I know from experience that chisel grind knives are not the first choice for those types of things. Per Japanese chefs, chisel grinds are the best knife out of the drawer for some kinds of material. Also my electric paper cutter at work is a chisel grind as is the old tobacco plug cutter at the antique store.

The Douk Douk is a better slicer than the Mercator Cat that has a similar blade, but a different, standard v-grind and secondary bevel.
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Why don't you do your own controlled testing then? I thought it was pretty decent, especially because the alternative argument is almost always "my chisel grind outcuts everything because magic". Again, what would you prefer he test? Sashimi?

Also, OF COURSE the tests are designed to favor thin, v-ground blades. They want to actually part material and that does the job the best...

It doesn't matter if they fracture with thick blades or not. Chisel grinds are the same damned thing as a v-grind, just tilted over half of the inclusive bevel angle with respect to the cut medium. They do well when you cut a slice of soft material off of a larger block, as the slice doesn't put up much resistance anyway and the larger block can retain its clean 90° edges and flat face. It doesn't really have anything to do with effort required, but more how the knife is able to produce slices of consistent thicknesses, which is important in culinary prep.

Maybe the Mercator cat you compared the douk douk to is thicker behind the edge, duller, or not actually comparable in primary bevel angle. As for other tools, like a cigar or paper cutter, they're probably chisel ground because it's easy to do and it results in a cut that's cleaner for the item being trimmed.
 
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1. Busy, gaudy knifes that try to cram in as many different materials and embellishments as possible (eg William Henry knives). Especially anodized parts like in the Sebenza.

2. Partially serrated blades.

3. Fantasy, tacticool, or anything overly aggressive looking.

4. Large logos and lots of text, especially on the blade (some of the GEC knives have this).

5. Made in China. I know there are probably lots of great knives coming out of China but I just haven't warmed up to this yet.
 
There aren’t really any specs that are a turn-off for me. Almost any spec can be an appropriate property at a given price point. Sure, 3Cr sucks most of the time but for a $8 knife, not so much.

Maybe generic “surgical steel” always sucks...as well as “tactical speed holes in the blade to accommodate multiple zip ties”.

Those always are a turn off.
 
I can adapt to most things with a little perseverance but I definitely have some likes and dislikes in knives. By the way, I own multiple knives with every one of these turnoffs.

Pocket clips with tip down carry only. I have a few really good knives with this feature and I'll never buy another...except for OTF automatics. OTFs really should to be tip down.

Frame locks. Cheap Asian imports to the expensive Sebenza, I find them difficult to open because the lock bar is always placed where my fingers are gripping.

Chisel grinds. I have a few Emersons but I'll buy no more.

Wave opening. Emerson again. Guaranteed to hang up in a frayed seam of your pocket and slice your fingers while you try to remove it. (Both the chisel grinds and wave on Emersons respond well to Dremels and diamond bench stones.;))

Hard to open slipjoint traditionals. I like my fingernails intact, thank you.

Handles that are too short to actually handle. I don't care if everyone and his dog loves short handle to blade ratios, I want more to hang on to when I use a knife.

Knives with wide profiles that take up too much pocket space. Some beautifully made ZTs come to mind.

Heavy, overbuilt folding knives that really should have been a fixed blade in a sheath.

"Deep carry" pocket clips, wire pocket clips. Both can make retrieving the knife from a pocket difficult.

Engraved, inlaid, embellished, jeweled, brightly-colored anodized, gaudy knives. Useless.

All the above are subject to change without notice. I used to despise assisted openers. Today I like them and I'm even fond of automatic knives.
 
Any knife that isn't Shirogorov, CRK or Rockstead... This doesn't sound pretentious, does it? And no disrespect to the companies that made the other knives I own, such as Fiddleback Forge, BRKT, A2, Emerson and so on...
 
1. Made in China
2. Cheap steel
3. Tanto, recurve, multi grind blades
4. Digital camo/camaflage designs
5. Zombie anything

I like different handle materials on each side of the design allows. I like frame locks, bern carrying knives for 40 years and never had one fail. I hope I never do because they’re still my favorite. I like simple straight forward designs like CRK, Greymans, etc. I’m finding I really like a curved sheeps foot blade.


Bad thing is I’m carrying a Chinese pos with black blade and big green zombie logo on the side of it! Why? Because my son gave it to me, he said that it’s so I dont carry or ruin a $400 knife! Thoughtful kid:)
 
Made in China. Japan/Taiwan ok.
Partial or fully serrated.
Flipper.
<3.5” blade.
 
What specs really turn you off when looking at a knife?

Finger choils on blades.

I bought a folder with one to give it a whirl only to discover that I have no use for them, they get in the way, and they contribute nothing to my knife usage while substantially reducing the length of the cutting edge.
 
-Deep hollow grinds.
They dont cut well at all.

-AUS8
-8CR13MOV
Both crap steels. I'd take AEB-L over either anyday.
-Absurdly flashy knives
-Serrations (unless on a dive knife, or for specific niche tasks) typically a plain edge will cut better in 90% of cuts.

I'm not typically a fan of chisel grinds but I've made a few that were incredible cutters. But thin stock really helps.
 
Weiss said:
What specs really turn you off when looking at a knife?

Finger choils on blades.

I bought a folder with one to give it a whirl only to discover that I have no use for them, they get in the way, and they contribute nothing to my knife usage while substantially reducing the length of the cutting edge.
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I agree with this the vast majority of the time. The only notable exception is the Spyderco Dragonfly 2, which needs the choil to give me a 4-finger grip. When choils are used to offset the ergonomic disadvantage of small knives, I understand them (another example is the design of the CRKT Pilar).
 
Serrations (most of my earlier knives had them - over it)
Compound (nightmare) grinds
Tanto blade (I appreciate their utility - just don't like the look)
Recurves, or other "odd" interruptions of the cutting edge (See: ZT 0055)
Blade length over 3.75
Weight over 6oz
 
Major turn offs?

1. Unmarked blades or blades marked "stainless" or "surgical steel."

2. Assisted opening when it's really not needed.

3. Sandblasted or bead blasted blade finishes. Black finishes too. I love a nice stonewash finish, though.

4. Metal scales on medium and heavy duty folders or fixed blades.

5. Combo blade edges. Give me a fully serrated edge or a plain edge. Not both.

6. Poor heat treatment.

I would say these are my top six. I can't say that any single one will always be a deal breaker but two or three on the same knife usually is.
 
[QUOTE="
Blade length over 3.75
Weight over 6oz[/QUOTE]
^^^
Dito for folder there is absolutely no legitimate reason for a folder to have a blade longer than 3.75 or for it to weight like a brick.
 
I'm relatively new to the knife habit, but I already have a list of deal breakers:

1. Frame locks and liner locks, mostly because they're only available for right hand use -- but also because I don't like to have my digits in the path of a closing blade. Also, a lot of the liner locks look really flimsy
2. Black coated blades
3. Partially serrated blades (maybe OK on the water, but a full serration would be better in that case)
4. Less than 4 finger grip (though somehow the Mini Griptillian gets a pass on this one...)
5. Assisted opening
6. Tip down carry

Aftermarket accessory deal breaker:

1. Custom scales with no option for left hand or ambidextrous clip placement.
 
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