ZDP-189 edge chipping test:

as more & more members do these various tests we will accumulate a better picture of alloy performance, ankerson & knarfeng on sisal, unit on radial tire sidewalls, my self on double cardboard & a multitude of others cutting wood & cleaning animals & fish. we will eventually form a fairly comprehensive opinion of various metals. i certainly welcome all efforts cutting whatever to broaden our understanding
--dennis
 
Jimnolimit, thanks for taking the time and trouble to do all these tests. Very interesting, and I particularly like the way you do the tests and present your results: using everyday stuff that everyone can relate to; stating clearly the number of cuts and how the cuts were made; showing them side by side at each stage of your tests; and explaining the details with microscope views. The closeup views are especially much better than just describing the results in words such as 'The blade chipped'.

With perhaps the exception of the microscope views, anyone can repeat your tests. Your approach is very transparent and reader-friendly. I like it and hope that you can continue with other steels. :thumbup:
 
thanks for the kind words everyone.


i wanted to see how long it would take me to remove all the chips on the edge and re-bevel it, so i timed myself. it took me 4 minutes and 46 seconds using only my 1000 grit norton water stone. after that i stropped the edge 4 times on canvas (no paste) and the edge was sharper than it came from the factory. i took it one step further and spent 2 minutes finishing the blade on the fine side of my hard arkansas stone (i think it's arkansas, it feels like 2000-3000 grit ceramic). i then stropped the edge 6 times on rubber.

here are edge pics after i sharpened it:


this is 40x-50x magnification:

ZDP-189
zdpsharpenaftermetalcuttest.jpg



this is 375X magnification:

ZDP-189
zdpsharpenaftermetalcuttest2.jpg
 
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jimnolimit said:
absolutely. the ZDP did even better than i thought it would. the ZDP didn't showed any signs of damage until i tried cutting through the crimped rim.

those pics are at 40x-50x magnification, to the naked eye, the small dents and chips are only slightly noticeable.
Click to expand...

It's all good though, thanks for doing it. :)
 
This test realy suprised me I was always under the impression that ZDP-189 was a weak brittle steel, while not the strongest in the world I think it would serve great as a lighter use EDC blade also edge retention is killer on this steel so I may wind up giving it a try.
 
I'm glad you test revealed that S30V is some darn tough steel and deserving of some respect as a quality cutlery steel. :thumbup:

Stropped on rubber what?? :confused:
 
cziv said:
Stropped on rubber what?? :confused:
Click to expand...

i have been using/testing an offset printing blanket. originally the blanket was about a square yard and i cut it into different shapes. the backing is canvas and the top side is rubber. the blanket material is extremely uniform and tough. i have to order some compounds to test it as a loaded strop.

714011.jpg
 
jimnolimit said:
i have been using/testing an offset printing blanket. originally the blanket was about a square yard and i cut it into different shapes. the backing is canvas and the top side is rubber. the blanket material is extremely uniform and tough. i have to order some compounds to test it as a loaded strop.

714011.jpg
Click to expand...

How about getting back to us with your results on that after you load it with some compounds. :thumbup:
 
i have a big piece of MDF wood that im going to bring to a local cabinet shop (maybe tomorrow) so they can cut me a bunch of bench strop bases.
 
you definitely changed my mind on zdp... it may be more chippy than s30v as evidenced by your test, but also you showed me that zdp is nearly ideal for what i like. anyone have an acies they're looking to get rid of? haha :p:o:D
 
Thanks Jim and Jimnolimit for the excellent information. I believe that attempting to compare steels in a quantitative manner is a fools errand. People's multitude of applications and techniques demand a qualitative view of things and an evaluation using fuzzy logic. Put another way, I find far more value in a large number of anecdotes. Besides, they are better reading. ;)
 
Thanks for the effort. I think this is a pretty decent real world test and shows what a reasonable person might expect in terms of performance. The test seems balanced (neither carving balsa wood nor batoning through a re-bar)...one can envision any number of scenarios where a tough cutting chore like this might be required, even if one would not choose it as an everyday or common activity for one's folding EDC knife. I see this test as on par with the batoning tests we often see on fixed blade knives where they baton through knots and things. I will say also that the inclusion of photographs certainly lends something to the test.

I am impressed with what I see being accomplished with both steels here.
 
While I am impressed with what I see as well. I don't know if it's in any way up to the lateral stess of some really hard use tasks. See S30V in action, I never get tired of this video! :)

[YouTube]Kyl2CGb2N38[/YouTube]
 
i decided to perform another test on my endura 4 ZDP. i figured the first test was me cutting metal cans why not try something softer. i took an old new balance sneaker (US made), size 12 and decided to cut it up. the edge angle was about 20 degrees per side. the rubber and glue was gumming up the blade, so toward the end of the test i was rubbing mineral oil on the blade to prevent that. i was hanging an inch of the shoe over the side of the table so the only thing the blade was contacting was sneaker. i believe i cut that sneaker into about 27 pieces.


zdpnbshoecutting.jpg





before the test, the knife would easily cut newspaper against the grain. after cutting the shoe, the knife would barely cut newspaper with the grain (have to use a sawing motion). the knife still cuts cardboard decently.




when i was inspecting the blade under the microscope after the test, i noticed a slight trouble spot. with the naked eye, the edge looks fine. this pic is at 40x-50x magnification:

ZDP-189
zdpnbshoecut.jpg




here is that spot at about 375x magnification:

ZDP-189
zdpnbshoecut2.jpg





this had me a little worried. so i took a pic of the other side of the edge to check it. i don't see the lines on the other side which makes me think it isn't a micro fracture. i think that when the micro chips on the edge flaked off, they got caught in the rubber and scored a line in the edge. also, those lines are at the same angle and going in the same direction that i was cutting. i will double check this after i re-bevel the edge.

ZDP-189
zdpnbshoecut3-otherside.jpg
 
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Seems like you are learning a lot here.

Imagine doing that with a 20 Degree inclusive edge. ;)
 
Ankerson said:
Seems like you are learning a lot here.

Imagine doing that with a 20 Degree inclusive edge. ;)
Click to expand...

i have a long way to go before i even get near the realm you're in :).

with 20 degrees inclusive, i wouldn't cut anything harder than a sandwich ;).
 
just to give everyone some prospective on how small that "trouble area" is and how things look at 375x magnification, here is that spot with one of my forearm hairs next to it.

ZDP-189
zdpnbshoecuthair.jpg
 
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i wanted to see what it would take to get the edge back to good working order. i made 34 passes on my fine ceramic stone in this order 5-5-3-3-2-2-1-1 then i checked the edge and did another 3-3-2-2-1-1. except for 2 very tiny spots, the edge is about as sharp as i started with. i could easily EDC this knife tomorrow and not have a problem. here is a pic of the "trouble" spot after the less than 60 seconds of sharpening:


p.s. those "trouble" lines were just scratches

ZDP-189
zdpnbshoecutt-spotafterhone.jpg
 
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You sure it wasn't just leftover dirt stuck in the bottom of the shoe? I've found that dirt in such small amounts that it feels like dust will still chip a blade edge terribly.
 
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