4.1 thread

CO hunter said:
thinking that they are not suppose to be live since the production schedule says to check on Wednesday?
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Ya maybe there's something going on that I don't understand?? Hoping so. I understand selling seconds, just don't know how you can do that before you know what seconds you've got to sell.
 
Hard Knocks said:
Ya maybe there's something going on that I don't understand?? Hoping so. I understand selling seconds, just don't know how you can do that before you know what seconds you've got to sell.
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Yeah I was surprised to see them for sale after the production schedule said to check back on Wednesday but then I saw someone on the Facebook group says that they ordered one so I had to go check it out...

I thought I saw that they were only waiting on sheathes though, so maybe they do know that they have some seconds.
 
Tinbanger said:
Factory 2nds will be available as we come across them.

That's what it says when you order a second
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WHAT DOES THIS MEAN????

Is this like a mini-presale for seconds, but without the name?

Do these seconds physically exist?

No mention of the projected wait or estimated shipping?

They must be getting through some 4.1 firsts if seconds are appearing, right?
 
I've had a suspicion for awhile that maybe Survive is selling all knives after the pre-orders as factory seconds. Perhaps because the factory 1sts are too few. If this is the case, then they would already have a pretty good idea about how many 2nds will be available.

Just a guess. :)
 
CO hunter said:
....I thought I saw that they were only waiting on sheathes though, so maybe they do know that they have some seconds.
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Silver Needle said:
.....WHAT DOES THIS MEAN????.....Do these seconds physically exist?.....
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CO hunter may have it, but the part Tinbanger quoted is what's throwing me off. If there's a number of seconds available and they go 'out of stock' when they sell out, I'm really going to kick myself for not getting one.

Tinbanger said:
Factory 2nds will be available as we come across them.

That's what it says when you order a second
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The 4.1 is THE KNIFE that I really want from S!K (along with the 6). However, them offering the seconds now (with GSO-4.7 Cru Forge V, GSO-2.7 still left to finish) along with everything else that has been talked about in the other threads is keeping me from buying one. To be blunt, I am frustrated and a little sad.

I have been vocal about my concerns on other threads and don't want them to bleed over to this one, but can someone help me to understand how selling seconds now even makes sense. I REALLY REALLY REALLY want a 4.1 in 20cv. I have configured my knife and put it in the card at least 5 times today. I REALLY REALLY REALLY want S!K to succeed... but I just cannot bring myself to push the "buy" button.
 
I ordered a F2 4.7 in 20cv a few weeks ago and the F2 4.1 in 3v today. It says to check the production schedule before ordering. The schedule says they will ship between 15-30 business days. I guess I'll see and will update when I receive the shipping confirmation. Personally, I've ordered direct from Survive in the past on a few 4.1's, 3.5's, and a 5. This was before they moved their shop with all of the upgrades. It's always taken them longer than expected, but I've always respected the quality they put out.

I have found myself buying off the secondary markets while waiting for the ones I ordered to ship. That way I have plenty of knives to play with while I wait. However, I could see some of your concerns because paying up front and not getting the product by the estimated time frame is frustrating. I currently have 9 GSO's and dont mind waiting 3-6 weeks for the F2's. However, I do need to stop because Im realizing that I have a problem. :)
 
supertac916 said:
I ordered a F2 4.7 in 20cv a few weeks ago and the F2 4.1 in 3v today. It says to check the production schedule before ordering. The schedule says they will ship between 15-30 business days. I guess I'll see and will update when I receive the shipping confirmation. Personally, I've ordered direct from Survive in the past on a few 4.1's, 3.5's, and a 5. This was before they moved their shop with all of the upgrades. It's always taken them longer than expected, but I've always respected the quality they put out.

I have found myself buying off the secondary markets while waiting for the ones I ordered to ship. That way I have plenty of knives to play with while I wait. However, I could see some of your concerns because paying up front and not getting the product by the estimated time frame is frustrating. I currently have 9 GSO's and dont mind waiting 3-6 weeks for the F2's. However, I do need to stop because Im realizing that I have a problem. :)
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I think "Factory 2nds will be available as we come across them" will trump the 15-30 day estimate....
 
Silver Needle said:
WHAT DOES THIS MEAN????

Is this like a mini-presale for seconds, but without the name?

Do these seconds physically exist?

No mention of the projected wait or estimated shipping?

They must be getting through some 4.1 firsts if seconds are appearing, right?
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Silver, what this means is that Fancier is finally saturated on ordering knives. ;)

But yeah, it looks a lot like a presale on 4.1 2nds.
 
Any word on this from Survive. I have the same questions about the 4.1 2nds. Am I ordering a knife that is currently at the shop waiting to be finished or some hypothetical second in the future?
 
McVeyMac said:
...

I might add that the most basic reading of their language is that they will be processing factory 2nds as they find them, meaning that these will be shipping before the preorders are all fulfilled
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This has always been the case. S!K sets aside seconds as they encounter them and then sells them in small batches. In the past they have consistently delivered them in a few weeks, and we have frequently seen guys get seconds before the pre-sales and pre-orders all done.

What seems to be new is pre-selling Seconds. By now, I am sure they have a good handle on "yield" for firsts versus seconds. They can probably gauge how many seconds are going to appear in this run of 4.1s. I cannot imagine they will immediately send out all the Seconds that get sold up front, in front of the pre-sold Firsts.
 
McVeyMac said:
I just carted one, and there is no estimate given on shipping except "While working on fulfilling existing GSO-4.1 orders, we occasionally come across blades with cosmetic defects. Those will be made available here as Factory 2nds. Please see our Production Schedule page for current estimated delivery times. Because of the minor cosmetic defects, GSO-4.1 Factory 2nds are sold at a 10% discount."

We know what the production schedule says about the 4.1:

"•GSO-4.1: Blades are being finished and preorders will start shipping as soon as all materials have been completed." (I do not know what this means)

Since it could take weeks to months for them to come across a 2nd, I see this as no guarantee of a delivery anytime that is a concrete commitment. It is variable as to when they come across seconds. It is possible that they have a good idea of approximately how many they are going to have. But if these start shipping before every single preorder is fulfilled, I see that this is in very bad form indeed. If they do fill factory 2nds before every preorder is fulfilled, this will likely be the last straw for me. In all of the vagueness and confusion here, I do find this very troubling. If they are taking pre-orders on factory seconds and plan to ship them after all preorders are fulfilled, great. But if any of the 2nds ship before all preorders are fulfilled, I am done.

I might add that the most basic reading of their language is that they will be processing factory 2nds as they find them, meaning that these will be shipping before the preorders are all fulfilled
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I've always disagreed with this sentiment. I see factory 1st knives and factory 2nds as separate items. If you have a factory 2nd knife available and ready for shipment, you don't sit on it, you ship it out. You treat it as a separate product, with a separate customer base. Its not a factory 1st knife, so you aren't putting anyone out.
 
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Hm, I missed that line on the confirmation. :-/ I thought it was the standard explanation on the product page for what a 2nd is. :( Now even I think it might be starting to smell funny here...
 
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