A reality check for most makers

I never said that makers are forced to sell to dealers nor did I ever say that they don't benefit from dealers as they do since dealers play a major role in a maker's reputation.

I'm just saying I don't agree with people making profit off of other people's labor. Also, Sam didn't do nothing in regards to the article publishing due to him being busy with the orders and any orders before them.


Why doesn't your favorite maker have knives on their tables when the shows open???
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This is because of him not going to shows anymore, all of his income comes from his site which makes it to where he has no reason to go to them.
 
Bladeful,

Please answer my question about Sam Butler and my article. As he directly and monetarily befitted from my labor.


I never said that makers are forced to sell to dealers nor did I ever say that they don't benefit from dealers as they do. I also view dealers as a major role in a maker's reputation.

I'm just saying I don't agree with people making profit off of other people's labor.
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So you are ok with a maker selling a knife to a dealer, the maker befitting from working with the dealer...(as you feel they can help that maker build a reputation.).you just don't want the dealer to make any money by selling the knife.

If a dealer can't make money from selling the knives...where do you expect them to get the money from?

How about a customer reselling one of your knives and making a profit? Do you have a problem with that as well? After all he did make money off of your labor as well.

Every person that works in the US...someone makes money off of their labor. Physical, mental and/or intellectual labor. That is what a business is started for. To provide a product or service that will allow the company to make a profit.

BTW, what is your name?

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Dealer
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
BFA

Quote:
Why doesn't your favorite maker have knives on their tables when the shows open???
This is because of him not going to shows anymore, all of his income comes from his site which makes it to where he has no reason to go to them.
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What???

Re-read my question. The maker is at the show...the maker has paid for a table. Why when the show opens up are their no knives on that makers table.

If he sold them all on the Internet why would have paid for travel, Hotel, food and a table fee. He could just call the show and cancel?

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
Yeah, I would have a problem with it as I don't agree with anybody making profit off of other people's labor, no exceptions. The dealer would benifit from having a quality knife that could be easily resold later on incase of needing a "quick" source of income, then they could get the profit without the use of increasing the price since quality knives by well known makers appreciate each year.

Must have forgot to put that on profile, Idc why it matters, but my name is Byron Reeves. Why?


What???

Re-read my question. The maker is at the show...the maker has paid for a table. Why when the show opens up are their no knives on that makers table.

If he sold them all on the Internet why would have paid for travel, Hotel, food and a table fee. He could just call the show and cancel?
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There would be knives on his table if he still went to them. So i'm guessing I dont fully understand what your asking. Or it could be that he hasn't fully set up his table yet.
 
Les,

You capitalist scum, your days of exploiting the worker are numbered!

Viva La Revolution!

P

Remember, we are watching you AND moose & squirrel

orig.jpg
 
Hi Byron,

Would you answer my question about Sam Butler benefiting from my labor.

Also, if a dealer is not supposed to make money from a makers knife. He is supposed to sell them for no profit??? How would help the maker get money so he could continue to buy your knives??

Also, would you answer my question about a collector selling the makers knife and making a profit off of the makers labor.

How you would pay a dealer that you benefited from working with. Straight rate or a percentage. After all you would be benefiting from the dealer's labor.

I realize your are in HS, do you have a job, if so what it is and who do you work for?

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
I don't agree with anybody making profit off of other people's labor, no exceptions.



are u seriously writing that ....r u kidding me....here's how it works:

1)maker sells knives to a dealer like les at a discount

2)les travels around the country going to shows showing the makers wares and possibly selling all of them

3)les incurs the expense of travelling to shows...taking quality photos of knives and adding them to his site....possibly spending time writing articles on said maker

4)the maker might recieve alot of press and favorable comments on their work in articles...on internet forums...at knife shows etc.

5)everybody is happy...les made money on the knife....the maker made money on the knife and quite possibly has gotten more orders from the deal and might be a little more well known and have goteen alot of exposure


les-please feel free to comment on anything i wrote if i mispoke....ryan
 
Hi Peter,

I am just trying to figure out how Byron would have people get paid if someone didn't make a profit off their labor.

If the collector buys a knife, they probably have a job that pays them a salary. Which is how they get the money to buy the knife. If they didn't have a job where would they get the money from to buy a knife?

Im sure when he answers my questions everything will be explained.

Why is it that so many makers think dealers just stand behind a table or have a web site and people throw money at us??? :D

Les
 
I don't have a vehicle or a license, so no. About a dealer making profit, I agree that they need to be benefited in some way since they help the maker out, but I don't agree with the way they go about making that profit.

About them selling for no profit, you said that on your site, 90% of the prices are the makers price, so isn't that what your doing? Ryan, what you typed sounds like its refering to the way a dealer benefits a maker. Thats not my point.

Well, maybe the maker should just give percentages to the dealer instead of dealer reselling the knife(s) for higher.
 
Hi Ryan,

If you are going to cloud the issue with common sense I am going to have the moderators to have you banned. :D :D :D

Makers and dealers enter into a business relationship where a synergistic effect should occur.

This doesn't always happen. Generally both parties benefit from the relationship or there is no reason to have the relationship.

Les Robertson
 
Les,

Where do these makers get the idea that it perfectly ok for them to exploit the public by by charging HUNDREDS of dollars for $40 raw materials and a little of their spare time??? I bet half of them don't pay any taxes either.

It is a disgrace, imho.

P
 
Hi Byron,

How about answering my questions, here they are again in case you forgot.

Would you answer my question about Sam Butler benefiting from my labor.

Also, if a dealer is not supposed to make money from a makers knife. He is supposed to sell them for no profit??? How would help the maker get money so he could continue to buy your knives??

Also, would you answer my question about a collector selling the makers knife and making a profit off of the makers labor.

How you would pay a dealer that you benefited from working with. Straight rate or a percentage. After all you would be benefiting from the dealer's labor.

An additional question:

Well, maybe the maker should just give percentages to the dealer instead of dealer reselling the knife(s) for higher.
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So you don't want the dealer to make a profit by selling the knife. However, you will give them a percentage of the sale?

So you would just give the maker the knife. Then when they sell it you would give that dealer a percentage? Wouldn't the dealer still be making money off of your labor???

I think if you answer the questions you may have a better understanding of how a business works.

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
bladefulart,.....what i posted is how a maker can benefit from a dealer.....if i was a maker and wanted to benefit in the ways i posted and a dealer like les wanted to sell my knives i would gladly give him a discount.....i wouldn't have a problem the way he makes his profit......he is benefiting my livelyhood with what he does.....and his......ryan

les-sorry for making too much sense..lol.....that's all i gotta say about the subject anyway.....ryan
 
Peter,

Excellent question.

Here is a follow up for you:

Should the maker benefit from his labor?

After all isn't the maker benefiting from the labor of those who built the machines the maker uses to build the knife.

just because the maker bought the machine doesn't mean that maker should be able to make a profit off of the labor of those who built the machines that help to make the knife.

Les
 
A little spare time? Well, if 20-80 hrs+ of grinding, sanding, polishing, fitting, glueing, heat treating, embellishment if any,handle shaping and polishing, leather work, inlaying if any , sharpening, etc is a lil then ok.

Sometimes the steel alone is $40, especially the higher grade modern high-alloy spearodized annealed steels. Also, many of these full time makers work 11-13 hours every day, thats more then a little.


Yeah, they still would be making profit off of my labor, just not as direct. As far as the maker benifiting from the equipment, the equipment doesn't come free. They allow us to physically work in oder to gain our profit, also most machines these days are made with the use of automated factories which means that very little labor is used in the making of them. Therefore, since automated machinery is doing most of the labor, i'm not getting profit from actual people's labor by using them.

As far as me answering your questions, I think I answered most of them. As far as Sam, yea he benefits from you and you get benefit as well from having quality knives.
 
Hi Ryan,

I think if Byron answers the questions you and I have asked he will get it.

Since he has never held a job before (nothing unusual about that for a guy in HS).

He has not been put into a position where a company made a profit off his labor.

What until he gets that first pay check and sees that some guy name FICA got 6% of his pay check. He will really be upset. Mr. FICA got some of his money and he wasn't even working at the place! LOL :D :D

I give Byron credit he at least gave me his name. There as still some adults I am waiting on for that information. :D

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
Wow! The common sense and logic has given me a headache. A dealer can make a percentage, but a profit is all wrong??? Do I have that much right so far? .......and Les one of us needs to re read your posts because it seems that you have inserted the word maker where it would have been more likley to use the word dealer because it reads like a maker is selling to a maker???

The reason I'm curious is because I have been trying to sell my sheaths at a profit, but I sell to dealers too and stupid me!!! I try really hard to see they have a profit while not exceeding my established retail prices. Help Me! where have I gone wrong.

Paul
 
He has not been put into a position where a company made a profit off his labor.
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If you meantioned company sooner, I would have understood what your getting at sooner. Of course a company makes profit off of their workers, who in turn makes profit off of them. How else could it go? Dealers should make profits Sheathmaker, its just that I have a different way of thinking then nearly everybody else, I guess its my curse or something. This is why im stuck with the mind set that ppl shouldn't get profit from other ppls labor unless its their own. If they benefit the actual worker by doing so, then I guess its ok, but I'm still not agreeing with it.

Anyway, getting late in my area, so I have to go and nice debating with ya'll. Everybody needs a challenge from time to time.
 
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