Bark River has taken $16,000 of My Money

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SnarlSlayer said:
This will be my last post in this thread until my money is refunded or January 1st, 2009. So if you quote it, please do so with the knowledge that I cannot and will not respond.

Mike Stewart has agreed in public to refund my money by December 31st. Although he did not state so explicitly, he did agree. Unfortunately Mike and I cross posted and it looks like i withdrew my offer after he agreed. That was my fault for not refreshing the page and I apologize to those I confused.

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Steven Youell
syouell@cox.net
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I do not know either one of you, but I do sincerely hope that you check with your attorney to see if there is any sort of statute of limitation or any other reason why the date of Dec. 31st., 2008 would be chosen by the opposing party as this may have a bearing on this case legally speaking in terms of time. I wouldn't know, but if your case is as simple as it seems, then there should be a resolution now. IF, say, Jan. 1st., 2009 is one day too late to file a claim against the other party, then you will want to change the date, and get your claim ready for submission before the deadline if there is a deadline, know what I mean??? It's worth looking into just to be sure, because I don't know why he or anyone would make you wait 3 more months without a good reason, such as a way out of having to pay you anything by convincing you to wait past the time limit to file your claim in the appropriate court of law. I am not a lawyer... but if I were in your shoes, I would certainly be asking one about the possibility of any significance of the date set for repayment, and the day after (Jan. 1, 2009) as it would apply to this matter.

Good luck to both of you in finding a palatable solution to this matter. :thumbup:
 
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Gotta agree with Jaxx. Not to mention the other things you could be doing, or even just the interest on that money that your loosing.

I read a few things MS had to say, and he seems like a really shady character. Who does he think he is deciding when someone will get THEIR money back. The OP should file a lawsuit without delay, why count on him to make good on this new, inexplicable repayment date? Failed to deliver at 90 days, failed to deliver on may 15, failed to make the knives, failed to honor the contract, failed to give a refund and you're still going to take his word?
 
Bladeandbarrel said:
I would google Mike Stewart+Blackjack knives and do a search for his legal issues before sending him 5 cents. He has been ripping people off in the Knife business for over 20 years but like a cat keeps landing on his feet as he really knows how to make a nice knife at a nice price. Don't get confused that he is a nice guy because of that fact- he isn't.
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At Blade this past year in a conversation with a well-known knife maker, I got my first hint of Mike Stewart being viewed in a negative light. This whole thread and the other one elsewhere has made me reflect back to that conversation. I understand Esav's point about sticking to the issue, but I think that prior practices are relevant in a discussion over this matter. It is, after all, simply a discussion and has no real bearing on the outcome.
 
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Guyon said:
At Blade this past year in a conversation with a well-known knife maker, I got my first hint of Mike Stewart being viewed in a negative light.
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I'm kind of surprised by that, you being a regular knife knut and all :). I've only been into quality knives for a bit over two years, I'm only a "part time" knife knut, and I became aware of the past issues nearly that long ago. It's one of the things that has caused me to hesitate every time I considered purchasing a BRKT product. (Came damn close to snagging a Slither when they first came out, in particular. Still have a "short" fixed-blade on my wish list.) It's a shame, because BRKT makes some damn fine knives and they're right here in my home state.

OTOH: It would seem Mike did buy supplies and invest in this production run. And if I understand correctly: Then SS up and disappeared for a while? If that's true: What's Mike to do, subtract what's invested, send SS the raw materials, deduct his labour and refund the balance? I'm guessing SS wouldn't be happy with that either. Instead it seems Mike's chosen to carry-on with the project w/o SS and refund SS after he, Mike, can be made whole in the deal, too. I'm not so sure Mike's the bad guy here, if my reading-between-the-lines understanding of the situation is correct.

FWIW. (Which ain't a damn thing, actually.)
 
EDCeeker said:
IOTOH: It would seem Mike did buy supplies and invest in this production run. And if I understand correctly:
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It does not appear that you do understand correctly, Mike was paid up front for the entire cost. That's payment for all costs and labor up front on a price and terms he agreed to.
 
The way I read it, it said that SS was gone from the forum presence. That is very different from not being able to be contacted at your residence. If the blanks have not been cut yet than the stock could just as easily be for another knife. Right?
 
cgd160 said:
If your purpose (posting this) was to hurt BRK&T, it's not gonna happen. Heck, I don't like reading things like this, but unless a knife maker is sponsoring terrorism, it's not going to stop me from buying a knife I like.
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While I don't think that was his purpose it's likely to occur to some degree. I was planning on an Aurora as my next knife but now I'm reconsidering because of what I've read. And yes, I went to the other place and looked at Mike's side of the story.
 
It would be great to hear that Mike had decided to give Steven his money back immediately, which I think is the right thing to do, but considering how he has conducted business in the past, I won't hold my breath. This is sad, because I consider Mike to be one of the most affable people I have communicated with, but he has done stuff that should have gotten him tarred and feathered and ridden out of the knife community on a rail.
 
After reading the other MS transgressions, I will wait and see how this latest one plays out before spending my $$ on BRK&T. It's a shame really, I didn't know he had such a sordid past. (I don't go looking for the bad.)

I really hope SnarlSlayer gets his $$ back.
 
I just happened to read this because it mentioned Bark River. I was JUST about to send in an order for two knives, only $223, but changed my mind after reading this. There are lots of reputable knife makers and dealers out there without supporting one such as this. Too bad, I had decided on those two knives, but I've already found suitable alternatives.
 
OK, I read this and the 15 page monstrosity at the other forum.

Here's what I see:
1.) BRKT was paid up front for a production run of knives.
2.) BRKT agreed to the payment and production schedule.
3.) BRKT did not meet the production schedule.
4.) BRKT did not meet the revised production schedule.

OK right there, SS should have at least been offered a refund.

5.) BRKT decided to NOT supply the original investor in the ENTIRE production run the product.

SS should have been immediately refunded his investment -- regardless of whether or not bar stock or tooling had been purchased, it was BRKT's decision to back out.

Here's where it gets really shady:

6.) BRKT refuses to refund the purchaser of the entire production run until AFTER BRKT supplies the original investor's requested product, produced with the money the original investor supplied, to the original investor's competition, simultaneously refusing to supply the original investor with not only their investment back, but refuses to supply the product to him as well.

Sorry, I don't care what Mr. Stewart thinks of SnarlSlayer, I don't care if SS is a psychotic lunatic that won't preoperly represent the product. The fact that SS's money was taken, and subsequently used to produce the product SS contracted for, and sell such product ONLY to what amounts to SS's competitors, and refuses to return SS's investment, makes Mike Stewart the bad guy.

All he had to do, to avoid all of this, is return the $16,000 when he decided to not do business with SS.

Sorry, I really like my Aurora, it's near perfect for it's purpose, but I can't justify doing business with someone who's willing to screw someone over like this. If those who like to howl "you don't know both sides" go over and read Mike's response, it boils down to "Long after I was supposed to deliver, I decided I don't like you, but I'm going to use your investment to make my money and pay you back what I owe when I damn well feel like it, and if you don't like it, too bad."

There's too many other makers and custom guys that are straight shooters that are worth doing business with.
 
Cpl Punishment said:
...Mike's response, it boils down to "Long after I was supposed to deliver, I decided I don't like you, but I'm going to use your investment to make my money and pay you back what I owe when I damn well feel like it, and if you don't like it, too bad."
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That seems to me like a pretty good summary. I love my Aurora and Barkies in general, but, yeah, they definitely don't look so good in this light :mad:
 
I generally stay out of this stuff, but I find myself surprisingly partisan on this one. I've been surfing the forums for a few years now. I've bought many knives and I've enjoyed learning about them, not the least from the BRK&T section on another site. I still own a few Barkies and I've given half a dozen as gifts to family and friends; I've also recommended them to others. I don't know either of the folks involved in this fracas, but I certainly don't like what I see. I don't doubt SS will eventually get his money back, but I believe it should've been refunded immediately. What bothers me most is Mr Stewart's, "we'll do it my way and that's the only way it'll be done" position, a stance I've also sensed in his dealings as forum moderator. I've nothing but respect for the man's knowledge of knives, knife history and knife manufacture. I won't be buying any more Bark River knives. My $0.02 worth, if that.
 
I don't know about you guys, but I am completely done buying anything BRK&T ever again. Just seems like Mike is quite simply a grade A, P.O.S.
 
Let me see if I have this right, SnarlSlayer pays Stewart 16k with proof of canceled check to make SS knives that he can sell through his marketing plan. Stewart doesn't agree with his marketing plan. SS says don't worry about it, leave it up to me to sell this styke of knife. Stewart sends him a drawing and criticizes SS for not having a bigger presence on the forum where Stewart posts alot. Stewart misses the deadline for delivery and then states SS won't get any funds until the knives are all sold through distributorships, which isn't the original agreement.

So lets see Stewart is making the knives to SS's specs. Advertising them on KF's, hoping he can sell 16k worth of knives through the forums or vendors? All the while SS has footed the bill for these knives and is holding his hand on his ass while Stewart tries to sell the knives which may or may not entail SS getting his investment back.

I don't know, 16g's is alot of dough no matter how you cut it. Don't understand why he just didn't make the knives and let SS worry about the marketing thing. Don't care much about who is wearing his knives etc. The point is that 16g is alot of money SS is trying to get back with what sounds like a breach of contract at the very least. I mean if I am going to market something and have someone make what I am going to be marketing, what do they care of how or where I sell/market the product? No one's business but the owners'. I don't have an MBA but it doesn't take Einstein to figure this out. keepem sharp

PS I would look into Black Jack knives too, lots of investors left holding the bag.
 
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