Beware Md 25V Ripped Me Off!

[marcinek]

I think everyone has given the OP plenty of attention and patience, especially for an issue that happened on another forum.

After rereading this several times, I think I found one sentence in post #19 that describes the issue:


Is this the case? Are all those pictures to show that the rail is straight? I'm not sure what you are trying to show/prove.

How about showing the tapped holes in the rifle to see if they are actually out of alignment? You can use something like wood dowels to show how straight they were tapped.

Unless this isn't what your complaint is.

I think you are right! I've been totally confused. He's showing us that the rail is straight!?! He's certainly done that successfully. Nothing appears to be wrong with it. Square, flat, plumb, straight, the whole kit and kaboodle.

Please show us what's wrong.

 

[wolfmann601]

You want to buy the thing? I'll make you a hell of a deal on it. Otherwise, go bag on someone else.

I'll buy it IF your "hell of a deal" is truly a "hell of a deal"

Everything is fixable................

 

[chavez556]

Guys, I've got to go prep my car for a track event tomorrow, so I'll have to check back when I get time. Ron, please go post your nonsense somewhere else.

Thanks for letting us know about the track we would have been very worried if we didn't here from you. I think if you didn't let the guy know the gun was bogus with in a few days it's now your problem . I don't know about anybody else but when I pick up a new gun first thing I do is take it all the way down and clean it then put it on paper . I think you should have let him know asap when something was wrong . I also think you should change the title of your thread.

 

[ron_m80]

Well since PHM14 is so busy, maybe the seller would tell us what brand of aftermarket barrel was used? I may be wrong, but in the early years of 10/22 modification craziness, not all barrel makers used the beveled (self-aligning) barrel lock, some may have been flat allowing the slip fit .22lr barrel to cant if not torqued down in position.

Some better photo's and less rant would have done wonders.

 

[phm14]

Apologies for any confusion, CA. I was assuming the pics were self explanatory. According to the best assessment of my gunsmith, and myself, the taps in the barrel for the scope rail were not drilled in the proper location, causing the mount to cant off center. The stock was also inletted badly off center, causing the barreled action to cant to one side, and the magazines to hang up instead of dropping free when the mag release is pressed. The stock inletting also causes the forearm to bind into one side of the barrel, whereas the design is supposed to free float the barrel. This binding is also the likely cause of the FTF (failure to fire) ~ every 10-12 rounds. The offset in the inletting is easily demonstrated my counting the layers of laminate on either side of the magwell. The gun was at my dealers for ~ 7 days before I picked it up, and spent another 12 days in my safe before I took it to the range where the problems became apparent. Realizing that I should have noticed the issues immediately, I offered to pay return shipping on top of eating my transfer fee. Instead of working with me on a solution, Md 25v immediately mentioned his lawyer, then proceeded to call me a liar. I continued to be professional, but did let him know that he would be exposed in order to warn the online community about his dishonest practices. Before the deal went south , I had asked him for his username so I could leave positive feedback on the forum. After it went bad and he had deleted the ad, he still refused to give his username, and informed me that any future emails from me would go to his spam folder. I can only assume that since most forums prohibit the posting of personal info, Md 25v assumed that he wouldn't suffer any consequences since I didn't have his username. Md 25v has claimed I bent the mount, and the pics show that the mount is not bent. He has never addressed the stock issue, instead he blocked my emails. I discovered his username yesterday, and began to make good on my word. I think the real question is whether Md 25v is the type of seller we want on our forums.

Did you guys read the above post? I've done my best to explain it. I'm going out w the wife, will try and check back later.

 

[ron_m80]

I've done my best to explain it.

If only that were true. You were far from objective, and look as though you are trying to solve nothing. Sorry I do not believe strangers on exclamation alone.

 

[phm14]

The rail in the pics is what the seller claims, in his own post on pg 1., that I bent by dropping the gun. This is the reason he gives on why it sits crooked on the gun. I posted pics of it to show that it is straight. If your going to post, please read the thread.

 

[Cougar Allen]

I've done my best to explain it.

Well, we're all doing our best to understand your complaint.... As far as I can figure out, trying to separate out the problems from speculation about what's causing them:

1) Magazines don't fall free. (That usually takes about thirty seconds to fix, but it could take several minutes. By the way, many people prefer not to drop their magazines on the ground....)

B) It fails to fire once in 10-12 rounds. (You ascribe that to the forearm touching the barrel, but that makes no sense. Maybe the action (or the chamber) needs cleaning. Maybe it needs more than that.)

III) The rail and the stock look canted and off-center to you, on close examination after you'd had it for 12 days. (Are the internal scope adjustments inadequate to bring it on target?)

four) The forearm touches the barrel. (That could take a few minutes. What kind of groups are you getting? Free-floating the barrel is not always best.)

 

[snowreaper1]

Jurys still out on this one. So far the prosecution has presented a far less than satisfactory case.

 

[viva la]

idk why i bothered to read this whole thread but i did and i am really not sure what the complaint is.

the rail is straight? I'm confused...in one post you say the rail is "cant off center" and later in the same post you say it is "not bent".

you left it at your dealers for 7 days, then waited another 12 to fire it. Why so long? When I get a new toy I want to play with it soon as i can. Hell, last gun i bought they ordered for me then had to listen to me ask everyday "is it there, did it come in yet?", then when i got it the first thing i did was head to the range to put a few rounds thru it.

 

[EMT_Lee]

He said the rail is not bent, the holes are off-center. I'm not sure if people are just trying to give the OP a hard time or what, but this shouldn't be too difficult to follow.

 

[phm14]

He said the rail is not bent, the holes are off-center. I'm not sure if people are just trying to give the OP a hard time or what, but this shouldn't be too difficult to follow.

Thanks for pointing that out, Lee. Some of these belligerent posts kinda make you wonder.

 

[marcinek]

Thanks for pointing that out, Lee. Some of these belligerent posts kinda make you wonder.

1) To me, and I'm no expert, this is the only pic that appears to back up your point. If you wanted us to see what is wrong, it would have been better to show a bunch of pics of that, instead of a bunch of pics of what is not wrong on the gun.

2) Wah. Seriously, you want to bring up a beef from another forum here, and then not have members here comment on your beef? You can't have your cake and eat it too.

 

[Gastonknife]

It may appear to me that the Scope mount rail may be slightly off - it does look like it was maybe bent. Where and when this happened - have no way of knowing. I do not see issues with any of the other comments made. Based on the amount of time the OP had the gun before communicating to the seller I'd say either they waited too long to point out the issue or the OP casued the problem - perhaps dropping it. No way to know what is what, but either way seems to be that the OP has assumed ownership of this issue. I suggest just getting a new mount and having your gunsmith redo of you choose. It's a bit odd to be chasing the seller accross multiple forums when the OP should accept their error of waiting a month to point out a perceived problem.

 

[ron_m80]

I would like to see this part of the rifle.

maybe from the business end of the barrel with

 

[wintermute]

I'm no gunsmith but I'm kinda confused why the stock would cause a FTF. Also, is the mount wobbly at all? If not can you get a good boresighting through the scope? If so, what the heck's the problem? Also a 5 minute sand job would relieve any stock material touching the barrel.

 

[CWL]

Jurys still out on this one. So far the prosecution has presented a far less than satisfactory case.

Less than satisfactory? I still can't figure out what he's trying to do except want to ruin someone's reputation.

All I can really understand from this is that he goes to the track and takes his wife out to dinner.

 

[bmilla35]

Less than satisfactory? I still can't figure out what he's trying to do except want to ruin someone's reputation.

All I can really understand from this is that he goes to the track and takes his wife out to dinner.

I'm sorry but THAt is funny.

I'll choose not to take any sides on this, but plan on following. Good luck to both parties getting everything resolved.

 

[alex]

That mount is not bent. It is the design of it being a very long cantiliver that sucks. Since that 10/22 is a more than likely a put together kit gun from components that are bought separately I am not surprised that you could have a less than perfectly straight mount. That Green Mountain barrel might have the holes drilled a few thousands off center in relation to the centerline of the action. The action, due to its own manufacturing tolerances could be off a "hair" to the opposite side, still within its allowable manufacturing tolerance. This tolerance stackup, in conjunction with the slip type fit of these barrels in these 10/22 actions could easily cause a cant like that shown in the OP's picture. All of that thus not necessarily make the gun any less accurate. It just looks crappy. The stock is definitely inletted off center but even that should not affect the accuracy of the rifle other than possibly having to sand a little bit on the part of the wood touching the barrel. If the stock manufacturer is going to replace it then at least that is once issue resolved.


All of the above being said, the only way to get these Rugers 100% to your satisfaction every time is to buy it fully put together from one of the well known gunsmiths who build complete rifles like Clark or Volquartsen. When you put the components together yourself, which on this type rifle is very easy to do, you could easily end up with what you have now.


Almost every used gun online that I have ever seen sold has a three to seven day return privilige or whatever is agreed up front and once those date limits are reached you own it. I think you made a major mistake by waiting almost three weeks to shoot it and try to return it after that much time. 99.9% of folks would not accept a firearm back after that much time had passed. If you have a target quality barrel on there now, with a good trigger, and that mount and scope is on there solid I bet that rifle still is accurate as hell and the canting, as long as there is no play in that cantilever, will only use up some additional adjustments in your scope but should not affect the overall potential accuracy. If I was going to keep that rifle I would have a gunnsmith shim the back part of that mount and have the action itself drilled and tapped and screw that cantilivered back end down in a couple of places.

By the way, how did the rifle shoot, accuracy wise?

 

[Danbo]

That mount is not bent. It is the design of it being a very long cantiliver that sucks. Since that 10/22 is a more than likely a put together kit gun from components that are bought separately I am not surprised that you could have a less than perfectly straight mount. That Green Mountain barrel might have the holes drilled a few thousands off center in relation to the centerline of the action. The action, due to its own manufacturing tolerances could be off a "hair" to the opposite side, still within its allowable manufacturing tolerance. This tolerance stackup, in conjunction with the slip type fit of these barrels in these 10/22 actions could easily cause a cant like that shown in the OP's picture. All of that thus not necessarily make the gun any less accurate. It just looks crappy. The stock is definitely inletted off center but even that should not affect the accuracy of the rifle other than possibly having to sand a little bit on the part of the wood touching the barrel. If the stock manufacturer is going to replace it then at least that is once issue resolved.


All of the above being said, the only way to get these Rugers 100% to your satisfaction every time is to buy it fully put together from one of the well known gunsmiths who build complete rifles like Clark or Volquartsen. When you put the components together yourself, which on this type rifle is very easy to do, you could easily end up with what you have now.


Almost every used gun online that I have ever seen sold has a three to seven day return privilige or whatever is agreed up front and once those date limits are reached you own it. I think you made a major mistake by waiting almost three weeks to shoot it and try to return it after that much time. 99.9% of folks would not accept a firearm back after that much time had passed. If you have a target quality barrel on there now, with a good trigger, and that mount and scope is on there solid I bet that rifle still is accurate as hell and the canting, as long as there is no play in that cantilever, will only use up some additional adjustments in your scope but should not affect the overall potential accuracy. If I was going to keep that rifle I would have a gunnsmith shim the back part of that mount and have the action itself drilled and tapped and screw that cantilivered back end down in a couple of places.

By the way, how did the rifle shoot, accuracy wise?

Sounds like some good information there; and, not belligerent, either.