Button lock wear?

[Kmikaz3]

This seems really low?

if that was my only knife, yes it is perhaps low. But i rotate my knives, so i guess 50,000 cycles would take me a few years.

 

[The_Knife_Man]

Wow, I didn't know we where talking 550 usa and 700 cad... that's chris reeves and hinderer money... send that back asap

If my pocket knife cost more than my car payment, it better be darn near perfect... period.

 

[Eli Chaps]

I already packed up ready to send it back.

Good call. That email was snotty and childish. At $550USD I would require a much higher level of customer service let alone product quality.

If you get any kind of retribution, which I doubt, but if you do, you come back here and post about it. You should in fact post the resolution regardless.

 

[Eli Chaps]

Ya know, that whole thing just rubs me wrong so I'm going to expand some.

This thread likely belongs in the Good, Bad, & Ugly sub-forum. It's an excellent resource for vetting these types of issues and that applies to all parties involved.

It is not uncommon for an owner to launch a thread that folks quickly reassure is a non-issue and/or act unreasonably. In the latter situation, those posts never go the way the OP intends. Even if there is a legitimate issue, BF members will take the person task for their conduct.

BF members are also very knowledgeable and in my experience, fair. As a collective, they have a good sense of when something is wrong and when it is not. They also allow for mistakes to happen and so long as the OP has acted with a modicum of respect, then this becomes the pivotal point.

How does the maker/manufacturer respond? Loads of people will be watching such threads, just as they are this one, to see the response to the issue. We'll all be sitting on the proverbial line waiting to see if we jump over to satisfactory and all is well or ooopppsss, not good, cya.

Guess where this email sent most of us?

 

[killgar]

If I knew that my knife was getting damaged every time I opened it, and not just damaged on a molecular level, like microscopic molecules of metal being worn off various surfaces, but damaged in a way that I could actually see the damage with my naked eye, I wouldn't care if the knife were still perfectly useable, or could be useable for years to come, that would seriously bother me to the point where I would not enjoy using, or owning the knife. I would feel that way about a $50. knife, and even more so about a $550. knife. In my opinion a $550. knife should last multiple lifetimes in it's original condition.

Reading the makers comments to the OP I couldn't help but wonder- would this have been so hard:

"I'm so sorry to hear that you are experiencing issues with your knife. I would appreciate it if you could send me the knife, at my expense, so that I can examine it and address whatever problems might be present. I can mail you a return shipping label or email one to you that you can print out, your choice. I look forward to resolving this matter to your satisfaction as I appreciate your business and consider the happiness of my customers to be my highest priority."

There, no admission of wrongdoing, no admission that the knife is defective, and no defensive attitude. Just good customer service and an apparently sincere desire to make the customer happy.

After all, it's not like the OP came here and said "Aw man, my knife is a total piece of junk! The maker is a crook! He sold me a defective knife! Don't buy from this guy!".

All he did was ask the community here, with their vast knowledge and experience, to take a look at his knife and tell him if something is normal or a possible problem. A perfectly reasonable thing to do. Doing such a thing can save a buyer the hassle of trying to contact a maker every time they think their knife might have an issue.

I've been on this forum awhile, and over the years I've seen many vendors and knife makers respond to questions, or complaints from their customers. The vendors/makers who respond like the example I wrote above always receive an overwhelmingly positive response from the membership here. But vendors/makers who get defensive, snippy, or surly often succeed only in turning off potential buyers. And "knife people" never forget.

Good luck Kmikaz3. I hope everything works out to your satisfaction.

 

[Dogdrawz]

Just spoke w/ someone on Reddit w/ the same knife. He said his lock has enough space where it's not a problem & no wear. Could be just this one is defective.

 

[Insipid Moniker]

Just spoke w/ someone on Reddit w/ the same knife. He said his lock has enough space where it's not a problem & no wear. Could be just this one is defective.

Yeah, the problem with the lock is absolutely not the deal breaker, at least IMO, the maker's response is.

 

[Kmikaz3]

Just spoke w/ someone on Reddit w/ the same knife. He said his lock has enough space where it's not a problem & no wear. Could be just this one is defective.

let say its an off issue but the fact i got burned with the email is enough for me to pass on the model altogether and im sure you would do the same if you get this kind of response.

 

[craytab]

I agree with everything you said, Eli Chaps ( Insipid Moniker , evilgreg , & ohers too, I even agree with @brownshoe to a certain degree but he made a donkey show out of his response, maybe more mind support is needed )

This thread likely belongs in the Good, Bad, & Ugly sub-forum.

That said, I do disagree with this. The customer service part sure does fit with the GB&U but the initial question is perfect for GKD! And the resounding answer given to Kmikaz3 is that the behavior of that lock is not at all normal, and the response he posted from Hoback didn't explain the situation and was rather pissy, all things many of his fellow knife nuts would not put up with.

I'm not sure any response from a maker or manufacturer would be able to confidence me what the OP posted is just fine. I'd have sent it back to the dealer. The response from Hoback would make me pack it up and ship it out as fast as possible. For me, not only did he avoid clearing anything up with the actual issue, he was also snotty and arrogant about the whole thing. Too bad, some version of his Kwaiback has always tempted me, glad to know I can cross that one off my possible purchase list.

 

[Eli Chaps]

I agree with everything you said, Eli Chaps ( Insipid Moniker , evilgreg , & ohers too, I even agree with @brownshoe to a certain degree but he made a donkey show out of his response, maybe more mind support is needed )


That said, I do disagree with this. The customer service part sure does fit with the GB&U but the initial question is perfect for GKD! And the resounding answer given to Kmikaz3 is that the behavior of that lock is not at all normal, and the response he posted from Hoback didn't explain the situation and was rather pissy, all things many of his fellow knife nuts would not put up with.

I'm not sure any response from a maker or manufacturer would be able to confidence me what the OP posted is just fine. I'd have sent it back to the dealer. The response from Hoback would make me pack it up and ship it out as fast as possible. For me, not only did he avoid clearing anything up with the actual issue, he was also snotty and arrogant about the whole thing. Too bad, some version of his Kwaiback has always tempted me, glad to know I can cross that one off my possible purchase list.

That's a good point. It certainly did start out as a completely legitimate GKD posting. I guess I was feeling that it was evolving into a GBU type thread. In any case, I think the OP has acted quite reasonably.

 

[craytab]

And for the record, I have and have had plenty of button locks, none of them have exhibited the behavior in the OP.

 

[Dogdrawz]

Yeah, the problem with the lock is absolutely not the deal breaker, at least IMO, the maker's response is.

let say its an off issue but the fact i got burned with the email is enough for me to pass on the model altogether and im sure you would do the same if you get this kind of response.

Oh yeah, the response email on a professional level...stunk. No matter how bad the OP's thread could have been "negative feedback/review/business" etc., the proper response should have been more professional & much more attention should have been paid to satisfying the customers inquiries & needs. Am I wrong or isn't this business 101?

 

[MarkN86]

if that was my only knife, yes it is perhaps low. But i rotate my knives, so i guess 50,000 cycles would take me a few years.

I may not be a knife maker, but I do know that a piston in a vehicle can handle literally millions of up/down cycles and explosions that push the full weight of a vehicle forward. A vehicle with that kind of material for pistons/rings would only make it 10 or 20 miles before losing the majority if its compression.

An average engine costs about $25 per pound, give or take, and they last a few hundred thousand miles. You pay $2000 per pound for that particular knife, and 50,000 openings sounds optimistic. Engines are slightly bigger and more complicated than the average folding knife, and the knife's materials aren't that expensive, so the cost seems to come from workmanship. Seems to me like you aren't getting the workmanship you paid for.

If you are happy with it that's fine, but for that price I'd have that thing on the first truck back to where it came from.

 

[jbmonkey]

Im kinda affraid getting some kind of retribution... i know now Jake is reading this thread...

You've done nothing wrong that i see. ya asked some honest questions and asked for some opinions and insight. nothing wrong with that.

I get the maker doesn't like bad press.....no one does, but you didn't throw anyone under the bus or even criticize the maker. your thread to me came across as honest and curious on others thoughts.

I dont know this maker, heard of him, but one has to assume hes a big boy and can handle some honest questions and postings that he doesn't like. if he can't hes in the wrong business. I doubt he's that petty to try to get retribution. he won't last long in this business if he does. i also believe his email didn't come across to some as he meant. i didnt read it so badly as others did. I could be wrong though, who knows...only the sender does. typing doesn't always translate well to ones meanings.

I wouldn't worry about it and use the knife if ya like it. the maker said its fine, so hes on the hook for repairs and shipping etc if it isnt, under normal cutting use of course. if ya want to send it back go ahead. your call.

 

[Kmikaz3]

I may not be a knife maker, but I do know that a piston in a vehicle can handle literally millions of up/down cycles and explosions that push the full weight of a vehicle forward. A vehicle with that kind of material for pistons/rings would only make it 10 or 20 miles before losing the majority if its compression.

An average engine costs about $25 per pound, give or take, and they last a few hundred thousand miles. You pay $2000 per pound for that particular knife, and 50,000 openings sounds optimistic. Engines are slightly bigger and more complicated than the average folding knife, and the knife's materials aren't that expensive, so the cost seems to come from workmanship. Seems to me like you aren't getting the workmanship you paid for.

If you are happy with it that's fine, but for that price I'd have that thing on the first truck back to where it came from.

You've done nothing wrong that i see. ya asked some honest questions and asked for some opinions and insight. nothing wrong with that.

I get the maker doesn't like bad press.....no one does, but you didn't throw anyone under the bus or even criticize the maker. your thread to me came across as honest and curious on others thoughts.

I dont know this maker, heard of him, but one has to assume hes a big boy and can handle some honest questions and postings that he doesn't like. if he can't hes in the wrong business. I doubt he's that petty to try to get retribution. he won't last long in this business if he does. i also believe his email didn't come across to some as he meant. i didnt read it so badly as others did. I could be wrong though, who knows...only the sender does. typing doesn't always translate well to ones meanings.

I wouldn't worry about it and use the knife if ya like it. the maker said its fine, so hes on the hook for repairs and shipping etc if it isnt, under normal cutting use of course. if ya want to send it back go ahead. your call.

When i buy a knife, i need to be 100% happy with it. If there’s a slight hint of doubt with the knife, i wont keep it and it go back to where i bought it. Imo

 

[jbmonkey]

When i buy a knife, i need to be 100% happy with it. If there’s a slight hint of doubt with the knife, i wont keep it and it go back to where i bought it. Imo

yeah thats why I said your call at the end of my post, cause it is your call.

 

[evilgreg]

My main problem with the response is the tone, it just reminds me so much of when Elliot Williamson (sp?) big-timed the guy who experienced what he thought was unusual staining on his blade. A sort of "you have no problem, little person, because I say so--I am an expert and know much more than you ever could, and I say it's fine" vibe that rubs me the wrong way altogether. We're talking about unusual looking wear on the lock mechanism, and even if it's just cosmetic we're not talking about a $20 beater, this thing is a $500+ hunk of gear.

 

[DocJD]

I would return knife for refund and never again bother the maker with my business .

OP questions were reasonable and did not deserve a rude / stupid maker response , IMO .

 

[Kmikaz3]

I would return knife for refund and never again bother the maker with my business .

OP questions were reasonable and did not deserve a rude / stupid maker response , IMO .

I went ahead and dropped it off at the post office today. Managed to make an exchange with a lesser but somewhat expensive, the Anthem. Im sorry if you guys wanted me to keep the money but i couldnt passed on that BM. Asked them to check the centering before shipping tho. So fingers crossed.

 

[Kmikaz3]

Thank you all for your kind supports, everyone. It warmed my heart. Definitely a great community, i enrolled in!