C Ben Susrool is ok! Problems solved!

The seller admits to just throwing out terms that he didn't think the buyer would agree to. Then, while at the post office, he admits that he didn't even package the knife up properly....he didn't even wrap the knife box up much less put it into another box. The seller has a lot of feedback so he obviously has shipped and received a lot of knives, packaging them should be basic knowledge to him.

If the seller didn't want to ship internationally to begin with, he damn well made sure that he didn't have to ship internationally in the end by basically sabatoging the process, especially after being paid $100.

I also love to hear how much "trouble" it is to ship internationally. I've done it many times to members on here and the extra form that needs to be filled out takes about 3 minutes as it's mainly personal information that you'd have to fill out anyhow on any shipping label. You can do it while standing in line waiting and it's very self explanatory.

The seller should have never agreed to his own terms much less the buyer agreeing as well, and no money should have changed hands. But it did and the buyer is now out his $100 for a deal gone wrong on both sides.
 
This is one screwed up deal from start to finish, and never should have gotten out of the gate.
I personally would refund the $100 and put this one to rest. If the seller thought his time was worth $100, what price does he put on his reputation. No matter if he feels he earned it or not, it is not worth it to keep the money, and have others feel you cheated the OP. Refund the money and kill this thing-it's the smart thing to do.
 
banksy said:
Had he shipped to a US buyer, then he would have been responsible for ensuring it got to its destination. He decided after making the deal that he didn't want to accept any responsibility for shipping abroad, despite having accepted $100 to do just that.

The buyer agreed to the sellers demand for a deposit in the expectation of receiving a knife. He did everything the seller asked of him, and is out 100 bucks.

And by the way, the buyer didn't "trash" the sales thread as he was accused of - he asked very politely if the seller would consider shipping to Belgium.

In return he has been scammed, simply because he is an international buyer and for no other reason.
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Agreed. And I feel the seller warrants a negative feedback.
 
The longer this continues, with most insisting the seller return the deposit, while saying he's going on their ignore list, you aren't exactly providing him an incentive. If he's so unwelcome here, he might as well keep the money.

It is hard to resist that warm, wise, moral feeling. Even if its proclamation is so counterproductive.
 
Esav Benyamin said:
The longer this continues, with most insisting the seller return the deposit, while saying he's going on their ignore list, you aren't exactly providing him an incentive. If he's so unwelcome here, he might as well keep the money.

It is hard to resist that warm, wise, moral feeling. Even if its proclamation is so counterproductive.
Click to expand...

So should we tell him that your terms suck, you know it's wrong what you did but keep the money and I'll buy from you in the future?
 
Well, I notified the seller of the GBU thread yesterday and he responded. Here are our messages:



Personally, I think the 100 dollar non refundable fee is ridiculous and totally goes against what this website is about. I guess it doesn't technically break any rules, but it leaves a nasty taste in my mouth. Especially since the seller won't come here and say anything.

As to the PM, I see no false accusations whatsoever. I see a forum member from Europe being taken advantage of and it's pretty disgusting.
 
Right - only this tommy boy uses common sense but not the majority fellow forumites.

Don't tell me it is your sales rule so you can construct, interpret, and execute it in whatever way you want or like. That email from the seller to the buyer in itself is deceitful because COMMON SENSE says if you do not ship your item you do not take your customer's money. "Non-refundable" always bear some condition and the way I read it is that if the knife was shipped but somehow did not reach the buyer then the money (including the $100) is non-refundable.

Echoing what one poster said above, it would not be surprising to me if the seller did not even make the routine effort on attempting to ship the knife.
 
This becomes even more bizarre. False accusations? Evidence? Of what??

Even taking the seller's own account of what transpired as accurate, he is 100% in the wrong.

Still, if some sort of evidence would persuade him to refund the deposit, I'm sure the OP would oblige.

As the seller refuses to post here or even reply to the OP privately, perhaps he could communicate his further demands through a mod?
 
banksy said:
It wasn't a matter of how much "work" was involved, the seller simply decided to absolve himself of any responsibility of shipping the knife after agreeing the deal:



Had he shipped to a US buyer, then he would have been responsible for ensuring it got to its destination. He decided after making the deal that he didn't want to accept any responsibility for shipping abroad, despite having accepted $100 to do just that.

The buyer agreed to the sellers demand for a deposit in the expectation of receiving a knife. He did everything the seller asked of him, and is out 100 bucks.

And by the way, the buyer didn't "trash" the sales thread as he was accused of - he asked very politely if the seller would consider shipping to Belgium.

In return he has been scammed, simply because he is an international buyer and for no other reason.
Click to expand...

The statement regarding 'trashing' the sales thread is spot on bansky. A bit of an exaggeration if you ask me........maybe not the only exaggeration???
I read a question by the OP.......that's it.
Also, I have a feeling English is not the buyer's first language and stating that he is at fault till he learns how to read is a bit cold.
I'd really like to see the seller return the $100......he'll wind up out nothing.....and maybe not make it on a bunch of ignore lists.
The worst I can say about the OP is that he REALLY wanted the knife........why else would he agree to those ridiculous terms??
Hope Tom comes to his senses.......out and out refusing to post in this thread speaks volumes.
Joe
 
Hello to you all. Sorry for my late response, but since i live in Belgium i am sleeping while you people are up and alive :)
First: i want to thank all of you for the massive support so far!
Now, mr. Tom does not want to answer to this thread, but calls me a liar and says I accused him of being a thief...
I have, Not like mr. Tom, no problem to talk about this mess from man to man.
But he just refuses to answer me...
calling me a liar....
I have no secrets whatsoever: anyone who wants to read our email conversation can send me an email.my email is cartman838@hotmail.com
I trashed up his thread? I asked him if he could ship to Belgium....he agreed....and i also said in one of my emails that i appreciated that very much...
I accused him? I will upload that email in an instant, you can all decide for yourselves....
@Tom: I am sorry that this had to go this far...but you do not have the right to keep my money! I interpretated your email wrong, and i APOLOGISE!
But like mentioned in one of the reactions above: do you really think i would agree you to take 100$ from me just for your 'trouble'?(wrapping and getting info at the post office for international shipping) I genuinely thought you wanted the 100$ to be sure that i would buy that knife...
So i am asking you nicely: PLEASE refund my money.after that we do never have to hear from each other again...
 
Ingels82 said:
Hello to you all. Sorry for my late response, but since i live in Belgium i am sleeping while you people are up and alive :)
First: i want to thank all of you for the massive support so far!
Now, mr. Tom does not want to answer to this thread, but calls me a liar and says I accused him of being a thief...
I have, Not like mr. Tom, no problem to talk about this mess from man to man.
But he just refuses to answer me...
calling me a liar....
I have no secrets whatsoever: anyone who wants to read our email conversation can send me an email.my email is cartman838@hotmail.com
I trashed up his thread? I asked him if he could ship to Belgium....he agreed....and i also said in one of my emails that i appreciated that very much...
I accused him? I will upload that email in an instant, you can all decide for yourselves....
@Tom: I am sorry that this had to go this far...but you do not have the right to keep my money! I interpretated your email wrong, and i APOLOGISE!
But like mentioned in one of the reactions above: do you really think i would agree you to take 100$ from me just for your 'trouble'?(wrapping and getting info at the post office for international shipping) I genuinely thought you wanted the 100$ to be sure that i would buy that knife...
So i am asking you nicely: PLEASE refund my money.after that we do never have to hear from each other again...
Click to expand...

It sucks that he cheated you and he should refund the $100. But by paying with PP friends you have no case even though the seller knows he's wrong. He said it himself you won't get the money back.
I was in a similar transaction two months ago. All things pointed back that I was wrong for using PP friends. I didn't have to but I paid back the money, because I KNEW I MESSED UP. I still got a negative that I fighting to get removed.

This guy because he knowingly cheated and will not refund because the buyer is outside the US deserves a negative. His "terms" are ridiculous.
 
Wow sorry you went through this!! At least your lesson in friends and family payments was only $100! I hope he does the right thing and gives back the money...
 
Wow. Just wow.
Kenny, After reading those emails you just posted I am saddened that this went down like it did and you are out $100.00.
"The $100.00 are for making me do something I don't want to do".
Nobody made the seller do anything.
C. BEN SUSROOL
Do the right thing and give this guy his money back.
Respectfully
Andy
 
Esav Benyamin said:
I have been in touch with C Ben Susrool. He sent me his side of the story. Please note he does not want to discuss it any further with Engels82, for reasons he states in the following message.

* ****** **** ****** *

I choose not to respond to this thread just as I chose not to respond to his last few emails where he threatened and called me a thief, crook and liar.
However, I will make these points, if you want to post them please preface them with the note that I choose not to give him the satisfaction of posting .
1. the fellow trashed up my for sale post trying to get me to agree to sell out of CONUS. (should have been my first clue he cannot read)
2. I did not "make" him do anything. I told him of my terms, never expecting him to agree to them.
3. He emailed me back saying he understood and asking for my PayPal address.
4. He sent the $100, I went to the PO with the wrapped package and had them weigh it and quote me shipping and insurance. I really didn't think they would insure it. They said they would at over $50 for priority mail, and IIRR somewhere near $36 for ship and insurance. He wrote back to go the cheaper route.*
5. I reported this to him, and he asked if I was going to give him credit for the first $100. I told him NO, that was not our agreement, to go back and reread our emails. He whined and bitched and I told him i could relabel the package and sell to someone else.
6. He sent another email, maybe the next day, and said I was right. He paid through PayPal.
7. (this all took place over a few days during the Veterans say holiday.)*
8. After I saw from PPal he had paid, I went back to PO with the package. There they told me I had to cover the package with brown wrapping paper. I did, then went back to the post office, they took the package and read the customs declaration and told me they could not ship a camping knife to Belgium as it was considered a
weapon. I asked to speak to the manager and was told the same thing.
9. I reported this Engels, and told him I would try to go to UPS the next day and see if they would ship it. Hours later, I checked online UPS and determined the shipper is liable, and decided I could not take a chance with confiscation and having to return the payment and shipping and losing the goods.
10. I reported to Engels that i had no other choice but to return his payment and shipping, which I did.
Then the threats, cussing and whining began. He said he was going to complain to PPal about something he did not agree with. I told him to be sure and tell them he did not agree with it now, but did originally.

Now it is the principal of the thing, I am determined he will not get $100 from me.
Tom
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Tom, I can appreciate the fact that you did not want to ship international, and that is very evident by your "terms". Surely you can also see that there was some level of language barrier between you two making a mis interpretation of your terms at least very possible, meaning the $100 was not refundable IF he backed out on the deal. It was not he who backed out! A far as not being able to ship to Belgium, I have shipped to and received from Belgium many times, and when the documents are filled out correctly and the package is wrapped correctly, or better yet in an International Priority box, I have never encountered a problem............of course, each time I actually WANTED to ship successfully so that may be the difference

You mentioned it now being the principal of the thing, and based on your reaction, I am forced to think you may not have many "principals". It appears to me that your stance is at best a spoiled child approach and at worst a blatant scam.

I sincerely hope that the members here do not think you are representative of all Texans. I am ashamed FOR you on behalf of other Texans.

Paul
 
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