Compact tacticaL hawk...

Ed, looks like you got a manicure!

The last pic shows how stout the metal stock is for the Winkler. I never imagined it to be that thick. Looks like a tank of a hawk.
 
harkamus said:
Ed, looks like you got a manicure!

The last pic shows how stout the metal stock is for the Winkler. I never imagined it to be that thick. Looks like a tank of a hawk.
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I always wear gloves when taking out the garbage.
The hawk is design so that most of the weight of it rest in the head. Making for a powerful strike.

DWinkler said:
The head is designed primarily as a fighting weapon to be used both with a swing like a regular tomahawk, and as more of a slashing type weapon when held by the grip area just under the head. The forward spike is designed to cause a lot of damage when the need arises. Make no mistake, these designs were developed for guys that have a real need for a weapon with these capabilities. They are not camp tools or politically correct in a regular peaceful world. Just like an M-4 rifle, maybe it can be used for hunting deer or rabbits but that is not what it was designed for. I am not saying there is anything wrong with other axe designs, just that these were developed with the help of and for those that use them and are very good at their job.
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This is what Rafael Kayan had to say about the head design-


Sun_Helmet said:
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Highlighted sections on the RnD Hawk are some features that went into the design of the Hawk head.

Held high under the head, the hawk head can be used in very close quarter similar to the Karambit.

The front spike allows an initial wound channel entry and the edge complements it by creating an even larger less manageable wound without having to retract the hawk once it penetrates.

We added enough clearance underside the bit/cutting edge and angled it out so that will not dig into the user's hands when gripped high. It adds an effective penetrating beak. Sharp force trauma first before chopping or slicing come into it.

The Bit is also angled so that it has the back cut options at very close range without having to commit to wide slashing strokes. It has to clear the initial gouge that the front spike hawks will cause. With a high hand grip the handle can trap a limb just enough so that the edge or spike can do the initial damage.

The Back spike is not made to be as sharp, it is for more blunt force trauma or for accessing the natural "grab" points of the body. We received feedback that sharpened back spikes snag on the gear or are a concern that its too many sharp edges to contend with in the dark.

Much thought (and effort on Mr. Winkler's part) went into making sure the beak at the front spike's end would not cut into the user's wrist when held facing in the opposite manner (back spike forward). He had to run thru several protos which were more pleasing aesthetically but had to be set aside for practical purposes.

Held in the back spike forward manner, the index finger has the same reference point as the back spike.
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That thickness is part of what attracts me to the Winkler. I have a GG&G Battlehawk, it's also 3/8" thick, but has no taper to the tang, so it weights 44oz. That makes it pretty slow compared to most hawks, but the power of the strike is amazing. The Winkler, seems like a great balance of weight, speed, and power. I'm sure the Greymatter is fast, but it will has less power on the impact. Everything has it's trade-offs.
 
Wow, those are some incredible hawks, and Etwood, your story is priceless. That hawk design combines the penetration of a knife with the power of an impact tool. I'm a huge fan of hawks in general, but I have a question. Functionally, is there a difference between some of these really high end fighting tomahawks and say, a Cold Steel Vietnam hawk? Would you need/want a more expensive steel than 1055 for the bit, and does a full tang handle versus a walnut haft give you any particular advantages in a fighter?
 
PayetteRucker said:
Wow, those are some incredible hawks, and Etwood, your story is priceless. That hawk design combines the penetration of a knife with the power of an impact tool. I'm a huge fan of hawks in general, but I have a question. Functionally, is there a difference between some of these really high end fighting tomahawks and say, a Cold Steel Vietnam hawk? Would you need/want a more expensive steel than 1055 for the bit, and does a full tang handle versus a walnut haft give you any particular advantages in a fighter?
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Think of it as a very well balanced crow bar, with the added advantage of a cutting edge and penetrating spike (for the occasional body armor or thick clothing). It’s just a more solid weapon being full tang. I can see myself using something les expensive like a Cold Steel trench hawk or VTac, but I do depend on these tools with my life at times, I want the best tools with me when things are bad.

The tool is half of the equation. Proper training and metal conditioning are a big part of it as well. Knowing how to deploy it rapidly and effectively, targeting on the body, etc.
It’s just one more advantage you have out there. I was in a prison riot situation a few months ago ( a story I will tell latter on) and I was glad I had my axe with me, it was a situation where a gun or rifle was not an option and the intimidation factor of the hawk alone got me and a prison worker out of a very bad situation.
 
PayetteRucker said:
Wow, those are some incredible hawks, and Etwood, your story is priceless. That hawk design combines the penetration of a knife with the power of an impact tool. I'm a huge fan of hawks in general, but I have a question. Functionally, is there a difference between some of these really high end fighting tomahawks and say, a Cold Steel Vietnam hawk? Would you need/want a more expensive steel than 1055 for the bit, and does a full tang handle versus a walnut haft give you any particular advantages in a fighter?
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The different grip positions, of the Winkler, change the way you can hold and use the hawk, in a fight. The balance of weight, it's mass distribution, is key to how fast the hawk can strike, yet it needs enough weight to hit with force. My SOG Fasthawk is just that, fast, but I can tell it doesn't pack the punch of my heavier hawks, nor does it bite deep. My other two full tang hawks are slower, lots of weight in the handles, but they hit harder. The Winkler-Sayoc's tapered tang allows for strength, with a balanced center grip, and yet the weight is at the head. Seems like the best of both worlds, speed with mass behind the blade/spike.
Sure the mass of the CS is also in the head, like most traditional hawks, that's a good thing. But, when you break the handle, you won't have the same weapon, unlike the full tang hawks.
The steel can vary for sure, as long as the HT is good you'll have a functional hawk. I bent the bit on my first CS hawk, chopping wood. Some steels will have better edge retention, some are tougher, just depends on what you want to cut or chop. Breaching axes vs. fighers vs. wood choppers will differ in their steels and HT's.
 
Interesting responses, thanks. Etwood sounds like your investments are more than justifiable. I don't see much of a role I'd need one for at this point, but they do make for some great eye candy.
 


Meet the RMJ Berserker. Serial #000.

The Berserker is made from differentially heat treated 4140 steel. The handles are 3D machined micarta, laced with 2mm accessory cord and laser engraved with Viking runes. RMJ plans on adding the Berserker to their product lineup, though the specs may change a bit
 
Does that have a 5.11 logo on it, or am I seeing things?

Looks like RMJ went on a bender and had a one night stand with an Omnivore.
 
foxx said:
Does that have a 5.11 logo on it, or am I seeing things?

Looks like RMJ went on a bender and had a one night stand with an Omnivore.
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That made me laugh out loud!
The first few were custom made for 5.11 as Christmas presents.
RMJ
 
Edwood7 said:
The tool is half of the equation. Proper training and metal conditioning are a big part of it as well. Knowing how to deploy it rapidly and effectively, targeting on the body, etc.
It’s just one more advantage you have out there. I was in a prison riot situation a few months ago ( a story I will tell latter on) and I was glad I had my axe with me, it was a situation where a gun or rifle was not an option and the intimidation factor of the hawk alone got me and a prison worker out of a very bad situation.
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Prison riot!?!? I can wait for this one:D Ed, you always have the best stories:thumbup::thumbup:
Stay safe brotherman
 
Edwood7 said:
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This is the smallest one I have, it’s a R&D Baby hawk, evil little axe that I carry under my jacket at times.
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Baby hawk, is that the 10 3/4inch version? Or an even smaller one not on their websites?
I'm asking because I'm looking for a concealable EDC hawk. Been looking at both the WK II Hunter's Axe (for the size) and the WK II Winkler/Sayoc RnD Compact Hawk. Recommendations? Edwood, you're the guru on this subject as far as I'm concerned.
I want a hawk that I can primarily use for bushcraft etc. (why I am leaning towards the hunter), but I also want it to be useful in a self defense situation should I ever be unlucky enough to need it. Truth be told there are other things I would rather carry for a self-def item, but knives, pepper spray, volt emitting devices, handguns, all are outlawed here. An axe is still considered a tool though. As long as the cutting edge is no more than 12cm (4.7")
 
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Senserazer said:
Baby hawk, is that the 10 3/4inch version? Or an even smaller one not on their websites?
I'm asking because I'm looking for a concealable EDC hawk. Been looking at both the WK II Hunter's Axe (for the size) and the WK II Winkler/Sayoc RnD Compact Hawk. Recommendations? Edwood, you're the guru on this subject as far as I'm concerned.
I want a hawk that I can primarily use for bushcraft etc. (why I am leaning towards the hunter), but I also want it to be useful in a self defense situation should I ever be unlucky enough to need it. Truth be told there are other things I would rather carry for a self-def item, but knives, pepper spray, volt emitting devices, handguns, all are outlawed here. An axe is still considered a tool though. As long as the cutting edge is no more than 12cm (4.7")
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If so, you need to look elsewhere as the Winkler axes are specifically designed as weapon.
 
How about the Winkler Knives 2 Camp Axe? It's a wood cutting tool, it's 14" long and weights 1.5 lbs. I've got one on order, so I can't review it yet.
Besides, how short can a wood chopper be? The Jenny Wren is 11.5" long, but only 18oz, I've yet to chop wood with mine, but I think the slighly longer and heavier Camp Axe will perform better. Dan has also re-designed the axe, it's skeletonized, and looks like the beard has more of a downward curve, giving it more edge length.
Here's the best part, IMO, it now comes with the felt lined kydex carrier. SO, you have that quick deployment, if you need it as a weapon! I hope I never do, but nor do I want to be struggling to get to my axe/hatchet/hawk or gun if I need them.

wkcamp_bg.jpg90367_2_b.jpg90367_3_b.jpg90367_4_b.jpgwk2-ca.jpg
 
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