Ebay seller "SPORTCOLBS" ... Listing descriptions misleading

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tendy said:
I have no reason to prove or disprove anything. You seem to forget that from yourself and the OP have come accusations and summations based on guesses, hunches, innuendo, speculation or whatever else it is called. The burden of proof lies with the both of you, all I am saying is that attacking someones reputation via the Internet should carry the responsibility of actual proof of wrongdoing, just like in the real world. If they are proven to have done wrong I would be the first to string em up, but stringing someone up without proof I believe is called a lynching. The Internet and these forums are a great place for learning, but the anonymity of the Internet far too often allows one individual or group to crucify someone with nothing more than a hunch. As for the "I and others with better knowledge" remark, I get my knowledge the old fashioned way, by studying the fact based evidence.
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Noone "Lynching" anyone here, so you are off base on that remark. We are discussing. Discussing the poor business practices that go back some years by these sellers. One in particular. Fact.....item descriptions have been posted that are misleading and/or not as described. Fact...items being sold as we speak have been buffed to "kentucky mint". Fact... one seller has been in possession of and sold at least one supposedly vintage knifemaking die. Fact.... Both sellers have a long and intimate history with one of the most notorious horse trading knife fakers ever to grace the hobby.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/570955-Jim-Parker?highlight=jim+parker
(This thread highlights the nefarious career from firsthand knowledge from some notable people and others just like you and me. With such a lucrative legacy and millions of dollars worth of inherited stock, who's to say that the same old thing isn't happening today?).
 
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tendy said:
I have no reason to prove or disprove anything. You seem to forget that from yourself and the OP have come accusations and summations based on guesses, hunches, innuendo, speculation or whatever else it is called. The burden of proof lies with the both of you, all I am saying is that attacking someones reputation via the Internet should carry the responsibility of actual proof of wrongdoing, just like in the real world. If they are proven to have done wrong I would be the first to string em up, but stringing someone up without proof I believe is called a lynching. The Internet and these forums are a great place for learning, but the anonymity of the Internet far too often allows one individual or group to crucify someone with nothing more than a hunch. As for the "I and others with better knowledge" remark, I get my knowledge the old fashioned way, by studying the fact based evidence.
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I have made no accusations about the seller in question. What I did in fact do was, bring to light that the descriptions of the knives in question, were inaccurate and dishonest... AND the worst part was, the seller made no attempt at editing the listings, to correct them.
I saved my messaging with the seller, but there is no need to post them here... I will however provide them to any moderator on BF's, that deems it necessary. All one has to do is search ended auctions for the seller. Read the description, and look at the pictures.

There has been no lynching. IMHO it has remained civilized. The intent of this thread was for informational purposes, not to stir up false accusations.
If this thread is deemed to be non productive, and off track, the moderators will close it. And rightfully so.. If I personally think it is serving no further purpose , and has drifted to far off my original topic, I will close it.

Karda said:
Noone "Lynching" anyone here, so you are off base on that remark. We are discussing. Discussing the poor business practices that go back some years by these sellers. One in particular. Fact.....item descriptions have been posted that are misleading and/or not as described. Fact...items being sold as we speak have been buffed to "kentucky mint". Fact... one seller has been in possession of and sold at least one supposedly vintage knifemaking die. Fact.... Both sellers have a long and intimate history with one of the most notorious horse trading knife fakers ever to grace the hobby.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/570955-Jim-Parker?highlight=jim+parker
(This thread highlights the nefarious career from firsthand knowledge from some notable people and others just like you and me. With such a lucrative legacy and millions of dollars worth of inherited stock, who's to say that the same old thing isn't happening today?).
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If nothing else comes from this thread, I think it is good that the subject of known unethical dealers, be brought up for the benefit of new members here, or those just getting started in collecting.
 
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Hey here is a nice test for you conspiracy theorists. Seller has 200+ knives for sale on ebay right now. How about Karda and 338375 checking them all out and posting some details of all the fakes??? Please also tell us the devious descriptions and purposeful lying about the knives and condition. :rolleyes:
 
i just read through all the threads linked with ref, to this seller....and the infamous Mr. Parker.

i for one, thank the op and karda for bringing this to light, and in details. while i've never been a "collector" of old or new knives only a user, so it has little to no bearing on me. it is nice to see what kind of nonsense, to take folks money, that goes on.

i think at the minimum enough has been given by both gentlemen.....to at the minimum, keep an eye out on this seller, and doing one's own due diligence before buying. which seems to be all they are saying. if the seller is a great guy and as honest as they come, i think he'd have no problem with buyers being warned to do their research, on the knife, before buying? right? if he's doing nothing shady, then he has nothing to hide from or to get upset about.

maybe in fairness someone should send a link to the seller, so he can respond if he so chooses? just a thought.....
 
Gastonknife said:
Hey here is a nice test for you conspiracy theorists. Seller has 200+ knives for sale on ebay right now. How about Karda and 338375 checking them all out and posting some details of all the fakes??? Please also tell us the devious descriptions and purposeful lying about the knives and condition. :rolleyes:
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Since you and rproctor are such experts and don't buy any fake knives, you are obviously in a better position to take on such a task....have at it. :rolleyes:

jbmonkey said:
i think at the minimum enough has been given by both gentlemen.....to at the minimum, keep an eye out on this seller, and doing one's own due diligence before buying. which seems to be all they are saying. if the seller is a great guy and as honest as they come, i think he'd have no problem with buyers being warned to do their research, on the knife, before buying? right? if he's doing nothing shady, then he has nothing to hide from or to get upset about.
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Exactly, jbmonkey. You get it. Others don't.
 
nice try - but it's in your court
Come on - you are claiming seller is a scammer - let's go

Are you afraid?

Maybe so - we will see - still waiting for you
 
Gastonknife said:
nice try - but it's in your court
Come on - you are claiming seller is a scammer - let's go

Are you afraid?

Maybe so - we will see - still waiting for you
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Actually, i've posted enough proof that these sellers, their sales and their individual knives bear watching and informed scrutiny, while you have posted nothing to the contrary that proves they don't.....the ball is in your court, mr. expert.
 
Never said I was an expert, never did I claim the seller is a con artisit and international conspirator.
You did - do not have to prove anything - you do

my, court - again you divert

I asked you to show us your prowess and go look at the 200+ knives that that seller has and tell us all which ones are the fakes and why.

Still waiting ???? I'll guess you won't and can't do it.

Surely you can find 1 fake there out of the 200+???
:yawn:
 
jbmonkey said:
i just read through all the threads linked with ref, to this seller....and the infamous Mr. Parker.

i for one, thank the op and karda for bringing this to light, and in details. while i've never been a "collector" of old or new knives only a user, so it has little to no bearing on me. it is nice to see what kind of nonsense, to take folks money, that goes on.

i think at the minimum enough has been given by both gentlemen.....to at the minimum, keep an eye out on this seller, and doing one's own due diligence before buying. which seems to be all they are saying. if the seller is a great guy and as honest as they come, i think he'd have no problem with buyers being warned to do their research, on the knife, before buying? right? if he's doing nothing shady, then he has nothing to hide from or to get upset about.

maybe in fairness someone should send a link to the seller, so he can respond if he so chooses? just a thought.....
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Exactly... That is the entire purpose of this thread. Nothing more, nothing less

Gastonknife said:
nice try - but it's in your court
Come on - you are claiming seller is a scammer - let's go

Are you afraid?

Maybe so - we will see - still waiting for you
Click to expand...

Gastonknife said:
Never said I was an expert, never did I claim the seller is a con artisit and international conspirator.
You did - do not have to prove anything - you do

my, court - again you divert

I asked you to show us your prowess and go look at the 200+ knives that that seller has and tell us all which ones are the fakes and why.

Still waiting ???? I'll guess you won't and can't do it.

Surely you can find 1 fake there out of the 200+???
:yawn:
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Why you are so defensive about the information that has been posted ? You seem to be taking this very personal.

Why do you not want to accept the information for what it is ? Information... This discussion isn't just from opinions formed by a couple members in the last week. It has been ongoing for years, and there have been people with far more knowledge that you or I, unless you know something you aren't sharing with us, that have given great insight to deceptive practices by a few sellers. Its not a personal attack, as you seem to think it is.
 
I think the problem for Gastonknife and myself is that the information being presented is being represented as fact when it is not. From Wikepedia "A fact (derived from the Latin Factum, see below) is something that has really occurred or is actually the case. The usual test for a statement of fact is verifiability, that is whether it can be shown to correspond to experience. Standard reference works are often used to check facts. Scientific facts are verified by repeatable experiments". Discussions are great, they give us all a chance to voice concerns, get feedback, but they do not always answer the problem. This started out as a discussion voicing concerns about something you saw, somehow it became a factual event involving conspiracies, shady dealings etc.... However there is only one problem, not a shred of substantiated proof has been presented. Unless someone here buys a knife, proves it has been reworked, proves the seller was complicit in said reworking, proves that the seller will not make things right, and proves that this person is involved in some kind of conspiracy then there are no facts, just guesses and hunches, bottom line a theory
 
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This one is too easy! Those who suspect and speculate are relatively safe, as they will not buy in the first place. Those who insist on verifiable proof will probably continue to buy and then one day they will receive in the mail their "verifiable proof", at some financial loss.

Case closed????:rolleyes:

Paul
 
So if we do not agree with you, you resort to distorting a quote??? Who the heck do you think are? How sad are you anyway, I hate when people just because you do not agree, decide to get personal, anyways I said what I said and I won't back down, you dont like it.....tough!
 
sheathmaker said:
This one is too easy! Those who suspect and speculate are relatively safe, as they will not buy in the first place. Those who insist on verifiable proof will probably continue to buy and then one day they will receive in the mail their "verifiable proof", at some financial loss.

Case closed????:rolleyes:

Paul
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Indeed Paul..... very wise and well stated.


tendy said:
So if we do not agree with you, you resort to distorting a quote??? Who the heck do you think are? How sad are you anyway, I hate when people just because you do not agree, decide to get personal, anyways I said what I said and I won't back down, you dont like it.....tough!
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How is my omitting most of your wiki educational excercise (as if i needed it) distorting your post?, it is still there for anyone to read.
Be my guest, don't back down, the longer this remains at the top of the forum the more views it gets.
If this topic saves one person from getting scammed by a fake or buffed item. (which incidentally makes a piece less valuable as a collector item, not more. It just raises the auction price higher to sell to the uninformed) or an item not as described then it is worth having this discussion with those whom disagree.
 
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338375 said:
... An authentic stamp is not someting the average person just ends up having laying around the house.
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Wrong. I have the original tang stamp die for the Schrade 171UH and another I forget. Quite a few Schrade collectors have one or more and a few have dozens. Stamping dies usually get sold as either scrap metal or as collectables when a company goes belly up. They don't get crushed as a matter of course.
 
How about one labeled as "near mint" with obvious pepper stains and buffing?

Photo 2. Obvious difference in level of polish between tang and master blade- not something seen on Catts of that vintage. Also notice the remaining pits visible on the small blade in that photo. Not bad condition, but far from "near mint".
 
Sword and Shield said:
How about one labeled as "near mint" with obvious pepper stains and buffing?

Photo 2. Obvious difference in level of polish between tang and master blade- not something seen on Catts of that vintage. Also notice the remaining pits visible on the small blade in that photo. Not bad condition, but far from "near mint".
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Which/What seller are we talking about, Sword and Shield?
 
Codger_64 said:
Wrong. I have the original tang stamp die for the Schrade 171UH and another I forget. Quite a few Schrade collectors have one or more and a few have dozens. Stamping dies usually get sold as either scrap metal or as collectables when a company goes belly up. They don't get crushed as a matter of course.
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I'm going way off topic, and I apologize to all for it. What do those stamps look like? A plate with raised numbers and letters, or......? What kind of tool steel are they made of? I am quite curious now that you mentioned owning a couple. I hope you don't mind me asking and the op and mods excuse me for going off topic?

Thank you Sir, in advance.
 
jbmonkey said:
I'm going way off topic, and I apologize to all for it. What do those stamps look like? A plate with raised numbers and letters, or......? What kind of tool steel are they made of? I am quite curious now that you mentioned owning a couple. I hope you don't mind me asking and the op and mods excuse me for going off topic?

Thank you Sir, in advance.
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They usually look something like this:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...other-eb*y-phoney-knife?p=7624043#post7624043
I'm not sure what kind of tool steel is normally used and it probably varies, but it is hardened to be able to press the image into the steel before Heat treatment.
 
I don't have a photo available of mine right now, but the stamp portion is rectangular with a smaller rectangular vertical shaft that goes into the socket of the stamping press. I don't know the steel type but it appears to be hardened stainless tool steel. You might imagine how many thousand blades it would be required to stamp before replacement. It is a neat collectable to display with the knives it stamped.
11wfwr8.jpg
 
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