Goodbye my friend....

killgar said:
I've seen a lot of threads about chopping wood with knives but this one really takes the cake.

Sometimes the world of knife enthusiasts can be a very strange place.

What I'm reading is that sometimes a knife is a BETTER tool for chopping firewood than a hatchet. In all my years of camping, and all the wood I've chopped for fires, under various weather conditions, I've never once said to myself "Damn, I wish I had a big knife instead of this lousy hatchet!"
.......
What I see is a very nice knife that died a pointless death. Just my opinion. Worth what you paid for it.
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Sir you don't know me, but there are good chances that I have used an axe more than you have. Please don't be offended.

You mention " a pointless death".

May I ask why that silly lot up there in Fallkniven world have designed and produced this knife?

For carving? Wood-turning is done with tiny blades, chisels, rasps and special knives, like the crooked-knife.
For cooking and eating? Have you ever tried to cook or eat with an f1? Lets just say you won't see any chef using it.
For big game? This is not a skinner at any case. And game like deer and wild boar (don't have anything bigger in Greece, like bear or dinosaur) can be skinned and cut with even a cheap kitchen knife. Even the joints yes. Even the head.
For fishing? I have never gone fishing for whale or shark or dolphin and to be honest I m not much of a fisherman but I can not imagine how a knife like this could be of use early in the morning by the lake, while Mrs Wife is making cake a few yards down the road. Does it float? If it drops into the water you will need a deep-sea diver to find it.
For making fuzz-sticks? no, not very good at this either. Its fat and con-vexed. It is no coincidence that most wood-turning tools have a scandi grind.
For murdering people? Naahhh, a katana would work better.
For making pointy sticks and tent-pegs? Maybe do some notches for some trapping? Its pretty good at these I must say, but even a SAK can get the job done.
For general purposes cutting? What does this include? Cutting ropes? Opening boxes? To be taken to art class? Use it while sewing perhaps? Have you ever tried to remove a thorn (or thaw I don't know the word) with an f1 for instance? I have!

Why make a knife as robust, small sized, thick, convex constructed, with premium Japanese steel, pinned and I imagine epoxied super hard micarta scales, Hardness of 58 Hrc (if I recall correctly), market it as a "survival knife", and issue it to army personnel? Because according to me...........THIS KNIFE CAN EAT ITS GUTS AND ASK FOR SECONDS!

This is what it was made for! To cut hard dry wood in any climate, to split it, to hit it with a mallet, to cut frozen things, to pierce, to withstand lateral force, to open cans, to cut 10" ropes like butter, not to brake if it falls on a rock during an unfortunate moment, to be rust-free and after that to be able to cut your food. I believe that using any knife of this kind in any other way is just not knowing your tool and its capabilities. And I m not saying it is indestructible. I used to remove its nicks and chips every night, many times by the campfire. But this is how it is. Your knife takes care of you and you take care of it. Like the hunting rifle. Or your boots. Or your gear.

So I don't agree that this knife "died" in my hands in vain. Also, about the use of the proper tools for the proper job, in the outdoors, most wise men will tell you that there is no right or wrong way to do things. It is always how you view a particular situation at any given moment.

I think batoning is a very energy-efficient way to deliver an excellent result in most situations. Especially if you know how to do it. Not only for firewood. Use it in conjunction with the saw, making stop cuts, thus shaping wood. Use it as a draw knife by hammering the tip on another piece of wood. It gives you more control. Think about it. Its useful!

I also regret the fact that my post, "a farewell to a good knife" as I named it, an attempt to communicate, exchange views and have some fun amongst a community of people of similar interests, has become something different, and has even attracted the attention of the manufacturer, who at this point could view it as insulting towards his work.
 
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The odd thing - based on the picture - is that all three pieces seem to have broken in the same place. I would not have guessed that a manufacturing defect would produce that result in a laminated blade, but that's an uneducated guess.
 
killgar said:
I guess I was raised in an unusual manner. I was raised to always choose the right tool for the job. Naturally if you're in a survival situation you use whatever you have. But CHOOSING a knife to chop wood makes about as much sense to me as choosing a pipe wrench to hammer nails.
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The problem with this mindset is you discover your knife isn't capable, or is defective, when it matters most. Again, some here will stick with the "right tool/get an axe" mantra and there is some wisdom in that, but wearing a pack or pulling a wagon full of multiple tools at all times when outdoors isn't very likely or practical. Murphy tends to show up when we are least prepared. That's why companies make/market "survival" knives. That warranty makes it obvious Falkniven is not willing to bet money, or a replacement knife, on that knife's durability. Then I'm not willing to bet my life on it. If I just wanted a fun, light, easy, and super efficient knife for play, I'll buy a $15 mora which will provide years of service. I even saw Cody Lundin baton with one of those the other night on TV:). If you always carry your axe/hatchet when out of sight of your vehicle, more power to you. I doubt many folks do that. I once fell in a small canyon and broke my leg 15 minutes from my truck. Luckily it wasn't a bad break, just being a cracked fibula, but climbing back out of the canyon was not an option. I made it out due to a good hiking stick (rattan cane actually) which I usually carried, a CS LTC kukri, and a strong desire to NOT hang out in a river vega filled with rattle snakes, feral hogs, and wild feral cattle. It could've easily worked out much different and made for a long uncomfortable night. That's one of the reasons I like the durable "survival" knife concept. If I break my ESEE while engaged in simulated "do or die" activity, Jeff and Mike will cheerfully ship me another.

And yes, I've hammered nails with a crescent wrench;). I've also used a diesel truck to drive across town to the store, even though a small car is obviously the correct "tool" for such tasks. It was what I had available.
 
I don't know exactly what purpose Falkniven had in mind when they designed the F1. I do know that with some of their knives (like their "survival" knives) they specifically state that they are good for chopping. But they don't say that about the F1. And the only warranty info I can find on the F1 specifically states that it is not intended for chopping or hammering. Perhaps if you contact Falkniven, they can explain exactly what the F1 is designed for. Personnally, it's of no importance to me. Like I stated earlier, I really couldn't care less what others do with their knives.

It was not my intention to offend anyone with my original post. It's merely one mans opinion randomly expressed on the internet. Worth only what others choose to make of it. There's no need for anyone to try and convince me I'm wrong. I have no desire to convince anyone that I'm right. And I'm quite certain that there isn't a single topic on this entire forum worth arguing about or getting upset over.
 
Giorgos said:
Sir you don't know me, but there are good chances that I have used an axe more than you have. Please don't be offended.

You mention " a pointless death".

May I ask why that silly lot up there in Fallkniven world have designed and produced this knife?

For carving? Wood-turning is done with tiny blades, chisels, rasps and special knives, like the crooked-knife.
For cooking and eating? Have you ever tried to cook or eat with an f1? Lets just say you won't see any chef using it.
For big game? This is not a skinner at any case. And game like deer and wild boar (don't have anything bigger in Greece, like bear or dinosaur) can be skinned and cut with even a cheap kitchen knife. Even the joints yes. Even the head.
For fishing? I have never gone fishing for whale or shark or dolphin and to be honest I m not much of a fisherman but I can not imagine how a knife like this could be of use early in the morning by the lake, while Mrs Wife is making cake a few yards down the road. Does it float? If it drops into the water you will need a deep-sea diver to find it.
For making fuzz-sticks? no, not very good at this either. Its fat and con-vexed. It is no coincidence that most wood-turning tools have a scandi grind.
For murdering people? Naahhh, a katana would work better.
For making pointy sticks and tent-pegs? Maybe do some notches for some trapping? Its pretty good at these I must say, but even a SAK can get the job done.
For general purposes cutting? What does this include? Cutting ropes? Opening boxes? To be taken to art class? Use it while sewing perhaps? Have you ever tried to remove a thorn (or thaw I don't know the word) with an f1 for instance? I have!

Why make a knife as robust, small sized, thick, convex constructed, with premium Japanese steel, pinned and I imagine epoxied super hard micarta scales, Hardness of 58 Hrc (if I recall correctly), market it as a "survival knife", and issue it to army personnel? Because according to me...........THIS KNIFE CAN EAT ITS GUTS AND ASK FOR SECONDS!

This is what it was made for! To cut hard dry wood in any climate, to split it, to hit it with a mallet, to cut frozen things, to pierce, to withstand lateral force, to open cans, to cut 10" ropes like butter, not to brake if it falls on a rock during an unfortunate moment, to be rust-free and after that to be able to cut your food. I believe that using any knife of this kind in any other way is just not knowing your tool and its capabilities. And I m not saying it is indestructible. I used to remove its nicks and chips every night, many times by the campfire. But this is how it is. Your knife takes care of you and you take care of it. Like the hunting rifle. Or your boots. Or your gear.

So I don't agree that this knife "died" in my hands in vain. Also, about the use of the proper tools for the proper job, in the outdoors, most wise men will tell you that there is no right or wrong way to do things. It is always how you view a particular situation at any given moment.

I think batoning is a very energy-efficient way to deliver an excellent result in most situations. Especially if you know how to do it. Not only for firewood. Use it in conjunction with the saw, making stop cuts, thus shaping wood. Use it as a draw knife by hammering the tip on another piece of wood. It gives you more control. Think about it. Its useful!

I also regret the fact that my post, "a farewell to a good knife" as I named it, an attempt to communicate, exchange views and have some fun amongst a community of people of similar interests, has become something different, and has even attracted the attention of the manufacturer, who at this point could view it as insulting towards his work.
Click to expand...

The finest response to about the most idiotic post i've read. Well said Giorgos!!!

There's a good reason i really, really like my Cold Steel Trailmaster - 7.9mm thick!!! That's not gonna crack anytime soon unless i don't baton correctly (it's possible....). Like you (probably), i've been using an axe/hatchet for a long, long, long time - over 30 years - and i baton with my knife *every* time i need something split in the backcountry. It's exponentially safer and more controlled.
 
People camp in different ways. I don't camp with a vehicle. I have a friend drop me off in the morning in the wild and then I hike all day until sundown and make camp. My friend picks me up at a specific location on a specific day. If I don't show then he knows something went wrong. I always provide him (and my family) with a map of my hiking route, planned camp sites, ect). I make sure my family has this info just in case something happens to my friend. The day before I'm to be picked up my family calls my friend to check in with him, and he calls them the morning of the pick-up. In other words, we take many precautions to ensure that I don't wind up a skeleton in the mountains. I don't drive myself because I don't want to leave my vehicle unatended for a week only to have it disappear.

Yes, I carry my hatchet with me. And I feel there's a big difference between carrying a light-weight hatchet, and "pulling a wagon full of tools" ;)And anytime I venture from my campsite, even just to relieve myself, I bring my hatchet, as well as many other items that I consider to be emergency survival necessities (flashlight, matches, tinder, folding knife, para cord, ect, ect) which I carry in a small fanny-style pack that I call my "life pack". I carry this pack on my person RELIGIOUSLY, and for good reason. If you do enough of this type of camping you hear horror stories of people who found themselves in life-threatening, and sometimes fatal situations, sometimes just a few yards from their campsite. I don't intend to be one of those stories. I consider my hatchet to be one of my top survival necessities and have never considered it a burden. I also carry a fixed blade, imagine that :) .

Back on topic. Knives can be used, and often successfully so, to perform a variety of tasks. Chopping, prying, hammering, digging, chiseling. They can be used as screwdrivers, tent stakes, an even to stir hazardous chemicals. But IN MY OPINION, just because a knife CAN be used for a particular task doesn't necessarily mean it was designed for that task, or that it SHOULD be used for that task. But heck, what other people do with their knives is their business. And it's up to the individual to decide what they should or should't do with their knives.

Just a few more random opinions shared on the internet by a guy with some free time to kill. Feel free to disregard them.
 
killgar said:
I've seen a lot of threads about chopping wood with knives but this one really takes the cake.

Sometimes the world of knife enthusiasts can be a very strange place.

What I'm reading is that sometimes a knife is a BETTER tool for chopping firewood than a hatchet. In all my years of camping, and all the wood I've chopped for fires, under various weather conditions, I've never once said to myself "Damn, I wish I had a big knife instead of this lousy hatchet!"

What I'm also reading is that by beating a knife until it breaks, against the manufacturers specific instructions, that it has somehow fulfilled it's knife destiny and died a glorious death. As if the only two options were to leave the knife in a drawer or beat on it till it breaks. I'm sure that if that knife had been used as it was designed to be used that it would have provided a lifetime of service and could have been passed on to future generations to provide them with a lifetime of service. Instead, it's now useless garbage.

I guess I was raised in an unusual manner. I was raised to always choose the right tool for the job. Naturally if you're in a survival situation you use whatever you have. But CHOOSING a knife to chop wood makes about as much sense to me as choosing a pipe wrench to hammer nails.

I understand that some people are REALLY into knives. That they REALLY love their knives. That they want to use their knives for any and all possible tasks. That they want to believe that their beloved knife is some kind of "SUPER TOOL" that can do anything. That they want to be able to brag about how tough their knife is and all the abuse they are able to throw at it. And of course it's your knife and you can do whatever you want with it. And I honestly couldn't care less. But it seems to me that in their "knife knut" fervor that some people have completely abandoned reasonable thought and departed from reality.

What I see is a very nice knife that died a pointless death. Just my opinion. Worth what you paid for it.
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It's funny you mention that. I came upon an upsetting reality when chopping up my papaya tree. I had chopped it down with my ESEE Junglas and was in the process of chopping it to pieces so that it can fit in the dumpster, when dear old mom pulled out that dull and rusted hatchet that my coworker gave me and made short work of the rest. Yes, that dull hatchet that's been rolled and chipped cut much faster and easier than my Junglas that I sharpened enough to cut free-hanging hair.

It does make one wonder what such knives are good at, if anything.
 
killgar said:
I don't know exactly what purpose Falkniven had in mind when they designed the F1. I do know that with some of their knives (like their "survival" knives) they specifically state that they are good for chopping. But they don't say that about the F1. And the only warranty info I can find on the F1 specifically states that it is not intended for chopping or hammering. Perhaps if you contact Falkniven, they can explain exactly what the F1 is designed for. Personnally, it's of no importance to me. Like I stated earlier, I really couldn't care less what others do with their knives.

It was not my intention to offend anyone with my original post. It's merely one mans opinion randomly expressed on the internet. Worth only what others choose to make of it. There's no need for anyone to try and convince me I'm wrong. I have no desire to convince anyone that I'm right. And I'm quite certain that there isn't a single topic on this entire forum worth arguing about or getting upset over.
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HaHa. I just went back and read their warranty and read about one of the survival knives.

Here is what it says about the A1-

Model A1 is a semi-large all-purpose knife for heavy duty use. The powerful blade is made of extremely hard yet tough laminated VG10 steel and will withstand the stress of hard use. The knife is superb to chop with, but also works very well with daily tasks, thanks to the ergonomic grip.

It says it is superb to chop with. But look what it says about the warranty:confused:

Warranty-The warranty is void if the blade is used incorrectly – the knife is intended for cutting with and is not for twisting, bending, chopping or hitting.


So they say the A1 is superb to chop with, but if you do, then you void the warranty?. What kind of crap is that:rolleyes:
 
Sounds like the warranty is copy and pasted from every other knife manufacturer's policy:D.
 
I am taking a Prius to Moab. I need a co-driver. Will you crew for me? :rolleyes:

fmajor007 said:
The finest response to about the most idiotic post i've read. Well said Giorgos!!!

There's a good reason i really, really like my Cold Steel Trailmaster - 7.9mm thick!!! That's not gonna crack anytime soon unless i don't baton correctly (it's possible....). Like you (probably), i've been using an axe/hatchet for a long, long, long time - over 30 years - and i baton with my knife *every* time i need something split in the backcountry. It's exponentially safer and more controlled.
Click to expand...
 
jeepin said:
HaHa. I just went back and read their warranty and read about one of the survival knives.

Here is what it says about the A1-

Model A1 is a semi-large all-purpose knife for heavy duty use. The powerful blade is made of extremely hard yet tough laminated VG10 steel and will withstand the stress of hard use. The knife is superb to chop with, but also works very well with daily tasks, thanks to the ergonomic grip.

It says it is superb to chop with. But look what it says about the warranty:confused:

Warranty-The warranty is void if the blade is used incorrectly – the knife is intended for cutting with and is not for twisting, bending, chopping or hitting.


So they say the A1 is superb to chop with, but if you do, then you void the warranty?. What kind of crap is that:rolleyes:
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I guess you found that on their old homepage , the catalog now only says "levering and prising", so they probably updated their warranty .

Link to PDF catalog.
http://www.fallkniven.com/images/stories/Fallkniven/files/catalog/no_print_eng_2009.pdf

1234,,,,,:)
 
killgar said:
...And anytime I venture from my campsite, even just to relieve myself, I bring my hatchet, as well as many other items that I consider to be emergency survival necessities (flashlight, matches, tinder, folding knife, para cord, ect, ect) which I carry .....
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Killgar,

Friend I think we will not communicate successfully, because I truly believe that we operate in different levels of consciousness.

For instance, you keep referring to chopping, while the argument that arose (unfortunately) in this thread, was to baton or not baton. That was the question!

Another example,that makes me think that as beings, we differentiate substantially, is when it comes to our bodily functions .
When I want to take a dump in the woods I bring soft paper, if I have with me, or some moss. Once, as a young boy scout, I used my socks (I threw them away after that). You bring a hatchet, flashlight, matches, tinder and so many other remarkably useful items.

So I think its safe to assume that when it comes to knives we also are not going to find common ground.
 
Fallknivens warranty is the reason why I wont buy one of their knives that are made in Japan and designed by a small family that used to be a Cold Steel distributor.


You can get a Ranger(justin), Barkie, Busse, ESEE......etc. and bust em' up with no worries.

Just carry two!
 
Brian Sargent said:
Fallknivens warranty is the reason why I wont buy one of their knives that are made in Japan and designed by a small family that used to be a Cold Steel distributor.

You can get a Ranger(justin), Barkie, Busse, ESEE......etc. and bust em' up with no worries.

Just carry two!
Click to expand...

What is wrong with knives made in Japan? Japanese steel is good quality and they've been making it since other cultures were running around with wooden spears in loin cloths. So the family was a Cold Steel distributor, what does that matter or how does it pertain to the thread? Should they not be allowed to sell or design knives or something now? :confused:
 
RevDevil said:
What is wrong with knives made in Japan? Japanese steel is good quality and they've been making it since other cultures were running around with wooden spears in loin cloths. So the family was a Cold Steel distributor, what does that matter or how does it pertain to the thread? Should they not be allowed to sell or design knives or something now? :confused: LOGGED OUT
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I stated my opinion ... that's not allowed on your forum?

They can do what they want.

... BUT a local USA maker with a LIFETIME warranty that asks NO questions is more valuable to me personally.

Pretty simple.

Has nothing to do with what you insinuate.

Have they offered to replace the knife or just want to "see" it ... curious?!

What I'm say is get a knife that you can count on the makers lifetime warranty ... Sorry you don't get it but I tried to explain. :confused:
 
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Brian Sargent said:
that used to be a Cold Steel distributor.
Click to expand...

And , Ek ,SOG, Shrade,Buck,Gerber,Victorinox,Kershaw,Brusletto,Eka,RB,Persson,Russel,Giesser,Puma,Benchmade,GT knives,
Richartz,Kai,United cutlery,Tool logic, Linder,Kainuun Pukko, Davvi Doudji.Blackjack , Eastwing, Randall made knives, Leatherman,,,,,,Distributor.


LOL !

1234,,,,,:D
 
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