Handle Grain Orientation
- Thread starter Old Axeman
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Ah, irony.
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My take on this is that there is an ideal handle standard that Bernie has described, and that most people agree with that standard as being ideal. I certainly do. However, the ideal is not always possible and practical. If no hickory is handy, or your alignment is off so be it. You use what you have unless it is really bad and an obvious danger. Scandivanians and Brazilians both have to hang axes on something, certainly refraining from woodcutting in the absence of perfect handles isn't correct. Use a great handle if you can, if not use the best you have.
The fact that people can't discuss such a thing without getting emotional and irritated with differing opinions seems silly to me. This isnt religion. I for one learn the most from hearing knowledgeable people explain themselves whether I share their view or not. Unless they talk to me like I'm an idiot for being open to other views. Then I stop listening.
The fact that people can't discuss such a thing without getting emotional and irritated with differing opinions seems silly to me. This isnt religion. I for one learn the most from hearing knowledgeable people explain themselves whether I share their view or not. Unless they talk to me like I'm an idiot for being open to other views. Then I stop listening.
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Nailed it.
Wow, step away for a few days ..( bold added for effect). I have done my share of chopping, wedge pounding, under bucking off an axe handle, etc. and the one thing I most look for in a handle is grain runout. It's also why I prefer to buy my handles from a hardware store, where I can separate the one good one from all the rest.
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Pretty simple concept really, especially for someone claiming to be THE AXE EXPERT. Competition choppers use 2-3 times the force of a lumberman. As well, the timbersports competitors cannot risk breaking a handle during the competition because they would automatically lose, and due to the increased speed and force used they would be risking serious injury. Hence, they use the strongest handles available.
They also use thick handles. Does that mean thick handles are better than thin handles? No.
And really, you should stop talking down to people. I'm sure you have made mistakes with axes, we all have.
Thank you for this. At least you used the words "from what I understand" and 'is preferred by some' instead of waxing eloquent from personal knowledge and prowess. The back end of a bull features prominently in much of the goings on of sage advice around here.
Beautiful.
Why don't you focus more on contributing to the forum rather than berating everyone all the time. Such is your wont, I guess.
I often go months without posting anything, because I don't have anything (constructive) to add. It won't kill you.
In the "It followed me home" thread, there is a photo of a broken hatchet handle. The handle has vertical grain orientation and I don't see any grain runout. But there are some issues with the mounting, including a metal wedge that looks like contributed to the break.
There are lots of reasons that a haft can break, but if we are aware of them and avoid as many as we can, if not all of them, then we'll have a better tool.
There are lots of reasons that a haft can break, but if we are aware of them and avoid as many as we can, if not all of them, then we'll have a better tool.
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For historical (and cross-cultural) reference, this illustration looks like it could have come out of "An Ax to Grind", but it's from a 1905 publication in Australia:
The author's reasoning for this hard-and-fast rule:
- All wood is harder to break at right angles to the rings (and easier to break when striking parallel to the rings).
- Handles made from sawn lumber with "the wrong grain" are liable to crack when strained (see Fig. 14).
- If the handle is broken at work, then you might have to go ten miles to get a new one.
- A lot of time is lost by taking out the old handle and putting in the new one.
- When chopping a big tree, there could be an unexpected hollow that the axe head penetrates into, causing a weaker handle to break when it hits the trunk (and losing the axe head as it falls down into the hollow).
The author also advises against a handle having both light and dark colored wood, saying that if you're offered such a handle by a storekeeper, "throw it at him, as the colours will separate when worked..." (A later publication by the USFS disagrees with the prejudice against heartwood in handles).
If a new axe has a bad handle, he advises to use it, and if the handle breaks, then replace it with a good one. If you are "extra particular" you can replace the handle right away.
"It is a curious thing that a good axe in the shop nearly always has a bad grained handle in it. The only way to do then is to use the bad handle till it breaks and then put in a good one. You can of course take the handle out and give it away if extra particular."
Also covered is the use of crosscut saws.
from
The Settler's Guide, by Robert Kaleski
Agricultural Gazette of N.S.W.
Jan. 3, 1905
The author's reasoning for this hard-and-fast rule:
- All wood is harder to break at right angles to the rings (and easier to break when striking parallel to the rings).
- Handles made from sawn lumber with "the wrong grain" are liable to crack when strained (see Fig. 14).
- If the handle is broken at work, then you might have to go ten miles to get a new one.
- A lot of time is lost by taking out the old handle and putting in the new one.
- When chopping a big tree, there could be an unexpected hollow that the axe head penetrates into, causing a weaker handle to break when it hits the trunk (and losing the axe head as it falls down into the hollow).
The author also advises against a handle having both light and dark colored wood, saying that if you're offered such a handle by a storekeeper, "throw it at him, as the colours will separate when worked..." (A later publication by the USFS disagrees with the prejudice against heartwood in handles).
If a new axe has a bad handle, he advises to use it, and if the handle breaks, then replace it with a good one. If you are "extra particular" you can replace the handle right away.
"It is a curious thing that a good axe in the shop nearly always has a bad grained handle in it. The only way to do then is to use the bad handle till it breaks and then put in a good one. You can of course take the handle out and give it away if extra particular."
Also covered is the use of crosscut saws.
from
The Settler's Guide, by Robert Kaleski
Agricultural Gazette of N.S.W.
Jan. 3, 1905
Back in the day, the depression era, there was a set of railroad tracks that came through this area. At the time there were only dirt roads for travel by mainly horse drawn wagons. The train was life. It hauled goods in and out of this part of the state. About the only income was from farming, or the vast stands of timber.
One of the people who told me about horizontally grained axe helves lived and logged during this era. His father and brothers logged with horses and mules during this time. Having a steep mountain farm with little to no flat land, they cut and made railroad ties as the only income. At the time ties were in high demand. This man told story after story about his life in the woods making ties. He also told me how they hafted the axes, with the grain running across the eye, opposed to the grain running with the eye. When I asked why run the grain in that direction, he simply stated "because it's the right way". Another older friend who had a similar early life in the log woods also explained to me this grain orientation as the right way to haft an axe. I asked him the same question as to why the grain should be across the eye, he explained to me how the axe worked "easier", and popped the chip better!
Over the years, I have found that wisdom to be correct. There is no sweeter cutting axe than my old Flint Edge with horizontal grain!
One of the people who told me about horizontally grained axe helves lived and logged during this era. His father and brothers logged with horses and mules during this time. Having a steep mountain farm with little to no flat land, they cut and made railroad ties as the only income. At the time ties were in high demand. This man told story after story about his life in the woods making ties. He also told me how they hafted the axes, with the grain running across the eye, opposed to the grain running with the eye. When I asked why run the grain in that direction, he simply stated "because it's the right way". Another older friend who had a similar early life in the log woods also explained to me this grain orientation as the right way to haft an axe. I asked him the same question as to why the grain should be across the eye, he explained to me how the axe worked "easier", and popped the chip better!
Over the years, I have found that wisdom to be correct. There is no sweeter cutting axe than my old Flint Edge with horizontal grain!
For historical (and cross-cultural) reference, this illustration looks like it could have come out of "An Ax to Grind", but it's from a 1905 publication in Australia:
The author's reasoning for this hard-and-fast rule:
- All wood is harder to break at right angles to the rings (and easier to break when striking parallel to the rings).
- Handles made from sawn lumber with "the wrong grain" are liable to crack when strained (see Fig. 14).
- If the handle is broken at work, then you might have to go ten miles to get a new one.
- A lot of time is lost by taking out the old handle and putting in the new one.
- When chopping a big tree, there could be an unexpected hollow that the axe head penetrates into, causing a weaker handle to break when it hits the trunk (and losing the axe head as it falls down into the hollow).
The author also advises against a handle having both light and dark colored wood, saying that if you're offered such a handle by a storekeeper, "throw it at him, as the colours will separate when worked..." (A later publication by the USFS disagrees with the prejudice against heartwood in handles).
If a new axe has a bad handle, he advises to use it, and if the handle breaks, then replace it with a good one. If you are "extra particular" you can replace the handle right away.
"It is a curious thing that a good axe in the shop nearly always has a bad grained handle in it. The only way to do then is to use the bad handle till it breaks and then put in a good one. You can of course take the handle out and give it away if extra particular."
Also covered is the use of crosscut saws.
from
The Settler's Guide, by Robert Kaleski
Agricultural Gazette of N.S.W.
Jan. 3, 1905
Thanks, Steve!
I have searched for older articles on axe handle making..the only thing that pops up is from, An Ax to Grind.
Holy cow! An entirely unwarranted put down.
When I first joined this forum there was a wonderful axe aficionado/historian//woodworker/wood purist gentleman from Belgium by the name of Ernest Dubois on board. Rude and crude folks continually disputed his lifelong-derived advice and ultimately he outright quit the forum. His quiet advice was worth the price of admission (to me) and yet 'we' lost him.
We (I, for one) cannot allow this to happen with Bernie.
I'd rather mull over and intelligently question one simple sentence of his (which would have been entirely derived from bona fide lifelong experience plus defending an unintended badge of notoriety) than have to put up with all the BS fantastic hearsay GD drivel from the majority of tin horn (but Google-prompted) 'loudly bleating sheep' that are also on here.
You are entirely correct sir, and thank you. Advice on the forum from you has rarely been forthcoming, so much so that I don't recall ever having argued with or disputed you, at all. Perhaps this then is a good time for me to take a break from all this foolishness since no one uses axes for a living anymore, anyway.
Here is less than perfect. Despite the horizontal grain it had less run out than all the others. I will take less run out all ways. It won't last though, they never do, even the ones that look perfect. If that haft was on a finish hammer it would probably never fail me.
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Garry, the handle on your collared hatchet caught my eye as very familiar. This is why!
The grain in your handle is VERY similar to the handle on my TT Kelly perfect hatchet.. The hatchet was bought new in '75 by my uncle. That makes it 40 years old this year.
He bought it to use in his tobacco stick business. For those who don't know, a tobacco stick was basically a thin riven stave roughly an inch square, and 4' 6" long. Tobacco plants were "speared" on to these sticks in the field. Then the tobacco could be hung in the curing barn by placing the tobacco stick across rails in the barn so it could cure. Most farms here in Kentucky at that time had many thousands of sticks for harvesting tobacco. White Oak was the wood of choice for riving sticks, as it was strong, generally straight grained, and decay resistant.
The hatchet was used to trim splinters and some heartwood from the oak staves before and after the sticks were riven from them. It was also used to make and sharpen gluts in the woods, and on the yard. But, its main purpose was to sharpen the sticks on each end.
My uncle gave me the hatchet about 20 years ago, and it hasn't been far from my side since. As a carpenter I use it at least weekly, and sometimes daily to hew crowns from joists, and sharpen stakes. Here on the farm it also sees plenty of use around the garden..and even when I kill hogs like pictured above. Anyhoo, I stopped in and asked my uncle(86) (who still has a mind like a steel trap) how many tobacco sticks he had sharpened with that old hatchet he gave me...his reply was, "better than 50,000". The old 40 year old hatchet is still goin' strong on that "horrible" grained haft after all we have put it through, and I think your handle will hold up just as well!
Several on here use axes to make a living, me included.. NOW, settle down and I promise I'll go to Lowe's, AND ACE hardware to find the haft with the worst runout in the bin, and snap a pic for you!
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But in competition a failed haft could cost you a championship and thousands of dollars. In that situation you swing only the best handle. Granted, the grind and weight might be different for axes used in the 60 second spurts of competition. But a top quality handle is still better in any axe use. A top quality handle isn't necessary - I've carved hafts out of tree branches that served their purpose. But if I'm going to the trouble of shaping a fine haft I'd be a fool to use less than the best available material. My labor is worth 5 times the cost of the materials. Why would I risk wasting my labor on an inferior product?
- Joined
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For historical (and cross-cultural) reference, this illustration looks like it could have come out of "An Ax to Grind", but it's from a 1905 publication in Australia:
The author's reasoning for this hard-and-fast rule:
- All wood is harder to break at right angles to the rings (and easier to break when striking parallel to the rings).
- Handles made from sawn lumber with "the wrong grain" are liable to crack when strained (see Fig. 14).
- If the handle is broken at work, then you might have to go ten miles to get a new one.
- A lot of time is lost by taking out the old handle and putting in the new one.
- When chopping a big tree, there could be an unexpected hollow that the axe head penetrates into, causing a weaker handle to break when it hits the trunk (and losing the axe head as it falls down into the hollow).
The author also advises against a handle having both light and dark colored wood, saying that if you're offered such a handle by a storekeeper, "throw it at him, as the colours will separate when worked..." (A later publication by the USFS disagrees with the prejudice against heartwood in handles).
If a new axe has a bad handle, he advises to use it, and if the handle breaks, then replace it with a good one. If you are "extra particular" you can replace the handle right away.
"It is a curious thing that a good axe in the shop nearly always has a bad grained handle in it. The only way to do then is to use the bad handle till it breaks and then put in a good one. You can of course take the handle out and give it away if extra particular."
Also covered is the use of crosscut saws.
from
The Settler's Guide, by Robert Kaleski
Agricultural Gazette of N.S.W.
Jan. 3, 1905
Great post, Steve. Thank you.
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I have had enough of this. The funny part is I knew better than to post on here, but took a shot anyway. Thanks to all who have looked at "An Ax To Grind" with an eye that history and tradition matter. Remember, I never wrote it for the general public, that means you should never have laid eyes on it. I sure hope the keyboard axeman on here dont hurt themselves while trying to reinvent the wheel from their chair in front of their computers.
Bernie
Bernie