interesting thread

Status
Not open for further replies.
Nope. Again, you guys are missing the point. We are not ganging up on Jimbo for having a difference of opinion. We are asking him to support his comments about a company and a knife maker that we care about peddling fear in order to up his market share.

Since Jimbo makes sense to you, and you are a reasonable and intelligent person, why don't you decifer the meaning of Jimbo's comments?
 
Originally posted by volvi

Jerry, I believe the OSF knife that you posted a pic of and mocked, is going to be a awesome outdoor survival knife. The size and design is perfect for the two uses that most true woodsman survival knives are used for: butchering game and woodwork.

So, by inferrence then, since I have never had use for such a "survival" blade, I am not a "true woodsman"?

And when did the term "survival" get neatly partitioned off into tasks such as butchering game and woodworking? I can butcher game and do woodwork with a sharp rock if I have too. I would hate to survive in extreme situations with nothing more... :rolleyes:
 
Or better yet... let's simplify this.

Please give me list of "survival" tasks that the proto pictured can do that I could not and have not achieved with a Busse. I can definitely give you a list of tasks that I would not trust the knife in the picture to do that I have done with a Busse.

I wait anxiously for your answer sir.
 
Jerry,

I understand and appreciate where you are coming from. I still think that, despite history, despite frustration and temptation, those who do you down can be refuted and stopped in their tracks most effectively through powerful argumentation, free of invectives. Not to sound too full of myself, but take a look at the type of response I posted on the first page of this thread. Discussion such as that can handle the situation definitively, without compromising the forum or one's compassion.

Les,

I didn't miss your point (that Jimbo spoke ignorantly, didn't back himself up, and evaded your questions). I just think the latter part of ths discussion could have been handled better.

--Mike
 
Dennis, (aka Volvi) Give me a break! You jumped in on the Busse Bash fest on the Randall forum a year ago with a load of nonsense. When I called you on the phone you apologized for all of your remarks. Give it a rest.

Nobody condones the name calling that took place and that was already addressed in a private email and online.

At 5/32 of an inch thick, 01 tool steel or CPM S30V will also prove to be incredibly tough and can actually be used to pry with.--- Volvi

This is the EXACT kind of unfounded and undocumented horse manure that gets spread over on OSF. Have you ever pried with S30V? Have you ever witnessed what happens to S30V when it sustains lateral stressing? I have. We have tested it extensively, and I can assure you that YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT! None! If you're going to pry with S30V, I suggest that you wear safety glasses and stand behind a thick sheet of steel.

Why don't you do something constructive with your keyboard expertise and email ANY one of the makers of the OSF paring knife and request some performance data? Cutting ability and lateral stress capabilities. I look forward to your results.

Jerry
 
Mike, I think that you are correct to a point. However, not being one to sit idly by when a friend is attacked, much less baselessly, I will be the first to call someone out.

Where I'm from, if you are unwilling or unable to stand behind your statements, you get what you get.
 
Les,

To be clear, I do consider Jerry to be a friend, and will stand up for him when he's baselessly attacked. I also do feel it is appropriate to aggressively press someone to back up their statements.

--Mike
 
Mike,

I agree. I think you and I agree much more than we disagree on any single topic but take a slightly different tack in terms of resolution. I'm sure that difference is nothing more than you and I havning different experiences coloring our assessment and reactions to things. I am not, in any way, questioning your loyalty or correctness in this issue. I am simply calling a spade a spade and attempting, in my own way, to shed some light on those who would cloud an issue with nonsense and run away from their own nonsensical and baseless statements.
 
First let me start off by saying! Man you guys are ass holes but that's ok so am i!

I don't pretend to be a survivalist or a spacial forces solder!

But what I'm is a builder i use knives every day! i chop with em i pry with em i dig in all kinds of **** with em i use em as hammers i cut wire! In other words i do all the thing you should not do to a knife! No madder what the manufacturer claims!

So here is my offer! One of you bad ass mother humpers send me one of these ultimate end all be all knives and i will put it to a test that would make even the most hard core among you cringe! And i Will wright a no bullshit report on it here and at the OSF forum! Then you'll all know and everybody else will know how they stand up to real world abuse not some imaginary jungle knife fight!

Here's my email address just in case you want to take me up on this!

lune2ne@hotmail.com

I'm not knocking your knives because i've never owned one!So if you want send me one tell me why i should spend 3 or 4 hundred buck on a Busse knife when in steaded I can spend 50 or 60 bucks on say a Becker! Use it abuse it and throw it away if it fails and only be out the fifty or sixty dollars! In seventeen years on the job i've only destroyed two or three knives beyond repair! So if the bad boys are as almost indestructible as y'all say they arethen i need one!

And as for the guy over at the OSF they never claimed to be hard core bad asses they just like to hunt fish and go camping!

So why don't you guy stop bragging and bitching like a bunch of 15 year olds in a pissing contest!And have a little fun in stead!

So many knives so little money
Robert M Brown
 
Originally posted by lune2ne

And as for the guy over at the OSF they never claimed to be hard core bad asses they just like to hunt fish and go camping!

So why don't you guy stop bragging and bitching like a bunch of 15 year olds in a pissing contest!And have a little fun in stead!

So many knives so little money
Robert M Brown

Robert,

Welcome to the Busse Forums.

This is not about "bragging or bitching". It is about having a man stand behind his comments with facts or at the very least a supportable opinion.

As for the OSF crowd not making claims... I beg to differ. They seem to want to discuss survival without any knowledge of such activities in a broad and realistic sense. They promote their forum as one about survival yet, make claims that suggest that they think survival consists of a very few subcatagories of said larger heading and then state that certain knives are not suited to that purpose and that certain knife makers are dishonestly promoting their wares by promoting fear in their customer base.

I have no gripe with campers or fishers. I do both. I do however have a complaint with those who would sell themselves as survival authorities and dispense opinions from said lofty perch yet, seemingly have a very narrow view of what constitutes survival. And when asked to clarify statements they made publicly they are unwilling/unable to stand behind their statements but instead, engage in double talk and outright ignorance the request for specificity. That doesn't seem a little odd to you? I does to me. Beyond which, it is not only rude and slanderous to engage in such activities, it is dangerous to those who are novices or are poorly informed but are looking to make an educated decision about survival tools and their uses.

Will I be sending you a knife? No. But thank you for the offer. I know of several real reviews written by "known quantities" that you may reference if you are interested in an educated opinion about Busse knives. One of them was just posted here today as a matter of fact. If you are interested in signing up for a spot on one of the upcoming test teams for Busse, I'm sure you are welcome to throw your name in the hat.

If you are content with your Beckers, that is wonderful. Everyone should be so lucky. Please continue to buy them if and when you destroy your current models.
 
You folks sure do like to hear yourselves talk, don't you? 6 pages of pointless BS, of the usual Bussephile "RAH-RAH, we have the coolest knives ever" crap. The reason SO many people loathe Busse knives (and the jerks who tout them as the end-all, be-all of knifedom) is your natural propensity to gang up on anyone who states the simple fact that they don't like your knife. It's as if you all have this huge, ego-crippling fear that if you can't prove how great your knives are, you just might realize that you've been taken in by a slick conman. Knives cut, prybars pry, and shovels dig. At least in the real world, where we don't feel a *need* to spend $300.00 or more on a knife with a poorly ground edge, crap handle and dangerous sheath. The ONLY reason Jerry Busse continues to make up new designs (emphasis placed on "make up") is that he knows he has a long line of dupes eagerly salivating at the chance to waste more money.

And before you ask, no, I have never, nor *wiil* I ever, buy a Busse knife. At first, when this was a young comapny, I actualy did want a Steel Heart with A2 steel. I t was a nicely made knife, and while it was somewhat expensive, it was clearly worth the oney. Now all of hype surrounding thses knives have destroyed what was a core of decent design and replaced it with a feeding frenzy by folks who consider themselves to be "real deal survivalists" because of the knife they own. How many times, in just this one thread, have you ALL stated that anyone that doesn't have a Busse is incapable of being a "true" survivalist or outdoorsman or SEAL wannabe? I feel quite certain that there are FAR more keyboard commandoes and Walter Mitty's over here than have ever been at OSF. The vast majority of hte regulars at OSF are outdoors nearly everyday, doing the stuff yu all say we *have* to have a Busse for, and doing it with Moras and Grohmanns. I don't get out as much anymore, persoanlly, due to health issues. But I gurantee that there is more collected wildwoods wisdom at OSF than there will EVER be here at Rambo central.

And I won't be coming back to see the usual sniping that will take place at my post (assuming it's not deleted). But you can reach me at the following adie: drakon@cdsnet.net AS I've said before, and did so again just this evening, I sincerely wish that we'd just *quit* talking about Busses at the OSF, or any decent forums, since al it does is bring you freaks into our homes, spouting off about your wunderknives. You like 'em, we don't. Learn to live with it, girls.
 
I'm just glad that I've had to work alot of extra hours latley and haven't been reading this thread or the one that started it:p

The simple truth of the matter: "If you don't own one of haven't used one (of whatever brand) then STFU!!"

I'm done:eek:
 
Lets face it what they think of as survival skills is what most people think of when they think of survival! which means a one or two week trip in the woods and living on what you carry! In that case some of them are very knowledgeable! But if you're talking about being a smoke jumper or seal team member and being dropped in a remote part of the world and told to survive! You're right they probably would not make it! But their not giving advice on life or death Their giving advice on living in the wilderness for the fun of it!

Actually I don't own either a Busse or a Becker! My point about the knives was! No amount of testing or warranties are any good when a knife fails you! You need right then and right there. It's like any other tool! If it's not there when you need it or if it fails then it's worthless! weather or not the make or reseller will fix it or replace it! Is beside the point!

Just use what you like and do what you love and every thing wil be all right! And don't worry about how's knife is the best and you can save your self some wineing!

Robert
So many knives so little money
 
So... your point is that testing proves nothing??? Am I the only one this doesn't make any sense to??? If I were going into said situations, I think I'd want a knife PROVEN to be as tough as it could be... :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :eek:

-Mark
 
No my point is! The only test that mean any thing are the test of actual use! You know is it the right size for carrying, is lite enough so you will carry it,Is it the best knife for the job you might put it too!
If you carried a Busse knife and a pocket knife which one do you think you would use more often even in a survival or war time situation! Tough is great but for me it would not be the deciding factor!

Robert
So many knives so little time
 
Jerry, your comments about that little OSF knife were uncalled for.
The OSF knife is a small personal knife, designed by and being made for a group of outdoor enthusiasts, who in most cases cannot afford the asking price of your products and is thus hardly a competitor.
As a successful businessman and head of a company that makes superior quality expensive knives, the comments do not become a man of your stature.
I really wanted a Busse Active Duty, but your atitude have put me off buying one.
I do not think loosing me as a potential customer will send you broke nor will you loose any sleep, but the fact of the matter is that you have, quite unnecessarily, alienated at least one potential customer.
Dirk
 
Gotta love some of these OSF guys. You put ask them to supply facts about performance and they either run and hide or they try to throw sand in the air and change the subject. It's hilarious!

I'll state it again. I want the leaders of this great group of knowledge seekers to demand performance criteria, including maximum lateral stress limits, impact limits, etc..., from the makers they promote. That is all! They have NO idea what the performance limitations of their "Survival" gear is.

If they do not seek this knowledge and continue to promote themselves as a "Survival" forum, then they can be likened to someone who bungee jumps off of a bridge with no knowledge of how long the bungee cord is or how much weight it can handle! It is ridiculous!

In one of the typical, UNFOUNDED statements made by one of their guys "Volvi" states
At 5/32 of an inch thick, 01 tool steel or CPM S30V will also prove to be incredibly tough and can actually be used to pry with.--- Volvi

Volvi, YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT!!!! NONE!!!
Have you ever stressed an S30V blade to destruction? We have. Many times. And based on that knowledge pool, not based on "hype" I will repeat, YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT!!!! NONE!!!
(The S30V blades we tested were hardened to the typical 58-60 Rc. Softer hardnesses should yield higher lateral strength.)

VShrake, Hey, Are ya doin' the ol' "OSF Throw smoke in the air, then run and hide"? Yeah, we've seen a lot of that lately. You know, if you start a fight, don't be surprised if someone fights back.

Jerry
 
Oupa,

I really don't have a problem with any knife design. Different strokes for different folks. However, I have been constantly chastised on that forum for my designs and edge geometry. Surprisingly, NO OTHER manufacturer has been. Then, to see a polished, slippery handled, guardless (poor design), shallow sabre ground (poor primary grind geometry) held up as the epitomy of knife design, I have to question why I have been constantly ridiculed on that forum.

As to you not buying a knife from me in the future? Yeah, I hear a lot of that from guys who have NEVER owned a Busse and now never will because of something I have said. :rolleyes:

Don't be afraid of knowing your equipments limitations. . . It's actually a "good thing".
 
After reading these two post i don't see what all the extra pissing and monning is all about it seem like they both got ther points a cross pretty well!

I well say one more thing! survival to me is being abal to do what needs to be done when it needs to be done.

If you want to give one to abuse the sh!t out of one my offer still stands!

You want hear from on this subject again unless some body replay to something i posted

Robert
So many knives so little money
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top