LARGE folder?

I would really like to see Spyderco come out with an X-Large folder for dedicated SD use.

-5" or 6" Blade
-S30V - SD knives need a quality steel
-Compression or Framelock, maybe a lockback like the Chinooks
-Steel Liners on both sides
-G10 is the best all around grip material in my opinion
-Flat ground blade for cutting performance
-Blade Style - Not sure. Wharncliffe maybe?
-Sharpened swedge for back cuts
 
The Military is about as big as I would go in a folder. It would be fixed blade territory after that. As it is I seldom carry my Military as it's size bothers the sheeple. I personally would not buy anything bigger as it would become a drawer / safe queen and I like to use my knives. :)
 
Sal,

I'll answer this from two perspectives:

-What would trigger my purchase.
-What do I think of the idea.

No question what would trigger my purchase would be a fighting knife, or knife with a tactical look to it. I bought several of the Terzulo knives, their kinda blunt ended, but a very beautiful knife, with a serious look to it. I have a Godard also, which is large, if not exactly tactical. I don't need a 6" folder if it's just for skinning a rabbit.


OK here is my take:

"the handle becomes larger than necessary to contain the larger blade."

By this I guess you mean it is larger than required to function purely as a handle?

I see two basic solutions to that:

It's a folder, not necesarily a pocket knife, I like the szaboinc.com RAD, the blade doesn't fold in. I think that's a great design. For a tactical kinda thing. It needs a sheath, or a Kydex point cover, but the idea makes a lot of sense. For a fighter, the two blade length the RAD has are good for stando-off, and close in techniques with a knife. But even on a user, you have some cool things happening. It would be much easier to use a 1" piece of blade sticking out the back, as a boxcutter, etc... you have real power on the point. particularly on a clip. Then you have the larger knife for other stuff. I think that would be really useful.

Forget tactical, I have a cooking knife that is 15.5" long, with a 5.25 inch handle, some are larger still, just begging to have a folding handle, so it would be more compact for a shore lunch in the tundra after a little troutfishing. Throw it in the wanigan in the canoe, and it's ready for almost anything.

The second option is to do something that is in addition to the handle, but that covers the blade. Think of the karambit. it's got that ring behind the handle. That would be useful as a skull/oyster crusher, or for a finger hold, or to tie off to, even on a bigger knife without the claw shape. Maybe the rear handle flairs out a bit back there on a survival knife, with a few threads in there, and you can mount it as a fish spear. So the handle is the right size, the blade is much longer than the handle, and the somthing else at the end of the handle is useful also.

The point with these examples isn't that any one of them is a good idea of itself, but just as a direction. Either make a folder with the blade overhanging, or make the extra handle fit with the rest of the story the knife is telling.

For that mater, the extra long handle can also tell a story, it just has to be packaged in some interesting way. A long blade with extra reach in the handle has to be useful for something.
 
Because of the blade to handle ratio has been done so well on the Shabaria, we know it is possible to have a good ratio. What does the original prototype look like?

I would like to see a blade shaped either like a Wharncliffe(x100000000), Vesuvius, or a SpyderHawk; flat ground please. I would like to see the metal in 30v or VG-10. I like thick blades. I like plain edges.

As far as the handle - I am an easy person to please. The FRN is ok; the G10 might be better, but for long lasting for anything but impact damage in combat - is anything else needed?

I like all of your locks - I know I don't have the wisdom of your designers concerning size, weight, etc. so you pick the lock.

Sal - everything about your being active here - as well as some others says you are my type of company and product. Thanks again sir.:)
 
where are all of those posters who were hollering for the Native Chief earlier?
 
I would be delighted to see a 4" version of the Native, but this thread is looking at the next size up. I don't think the Native's wide spearpoint would be the bet choice for a 5"+ folder. If nothing else a narrower spearpoint would be necessary to keep the grip from being way too large.

My personal preference is still for a nice extra-large recurve design.

--Bob Q
 
I had gotten so emotionally involved in the Native Chief that when Sal said it wouldn't happen I stopped visiting this forum.
I already have a Native, and only a Native Chief could entice me to buy another Syderco now.

To me, the only justification for a large folder revolves around self-defense.
That means point and enough length to make the point count.
I can always use a self-defense knife for the mundane, but in a real self-defense situation, I want a real self-defense knife.

If anyone wants to see a real self-defense folder, go look at the Extrema Ratio Nemesis.
The Nemesis does it all with total ambidexterity, and I mean total ambidexterity (kinda like a Native).
After the Native, Spyderco seems to have forgotten what ambidextrous means, although I see the word used to describe several Spyderco knives that only makes concessions to left-handers.

But let's go through the drill again.

Make it a BIG NATIVE CHIEF, with a sharpenable swedge.
Spyderco may not like the image or the liability that goes along with a sharpened swedge, but Spyderco can at least leave sharpening the swedge as a doable option for the final user.
In the Native 3D, Spyderco removed that option.
Too bad.

Anyway, a sharpenable-swedged spearpoint at 4.5" made out of S30V.
Give the whole knife a Native curve, so a person can put some shove behind it.
Put a contour in the blade at the choil, ala Native, so that a person can choke up on the blade and sink the butt deep into the cup of his palm and little finger, again so someone can put some shove into it; this also makes the back cut much more effective.

Make it a lockback with a clip moveable to either side, again like the Native.
And make it an MBC quality lockback, like the Nemesis.
This will make the knife truly ambidextrous.
And ambidextrous counts, not only for left-handers, but for right-handed people who want to carry their backup knife opposite their handgun, on the left side.
As a left-hander, when I carry a handgun on my left side, I like to move my Native over to the right side.
Think about it.

Make it point-up so that the clip fits in the cup of the palm.
That means with clip anchored in the butt of the grip and not at the pivot end.
Otherwise, the clip interferes with both the paintbrush grip and the saber grip.

No one will ever make a folder as strong as a fixed blade, but dual steel liners and an over-sized pivot would make this knife a lot more dependable in a desperate situation, just as the skeletal steel liners in the Benchmade AFCK make it a much more credible self-defense knife.

In other words, make the Native Chief.

The last time we went around about the Native Chief, or Native American, people tried to preorder it, and I felt very disappointed when Spyderco said "Oh, just kidding, sorry about that."
Like I said, I haven't participated in this forum since then, until now.
Unless I hear about a Native Chief or Native American in the works pretty soon, I intend to buy an Extrema Ratio Nemesis.
By the way, look at the handle of the Nemesis.
It will easily cover a sharpened swedge.

Why can't Spyderco make a knife like the Native American (like the Nemesis) that knocks the whole industry on its ear?
Go look at the Nemesis, give it a sharpenable swedge, and make it in America.
I'll pay $300 right now, sight unseen, if Spyderco will make that commitment.
 
Since one other person also brought up the RAD, I'll post a pic of the Mini-Rad which I mentioned. 5" blade:

ba03631.jpg


The photo is from Bladeart.com
 
The Mini-RAD is probably the only mega-folder I'd buy. As has been mentioned, if I want a large blade, I'll buy/carry/use a fixed blade.

I can see how mega-folders have an appeal for places like California where a folder of any size is legal but no fixed blades. But I doubt I'd carry one even if I lived in a place like that.

My Police is the largest folder I've ever carried and frankly I've never come close to utilizing its size in the urban environment in which I live. Not that I can't use a large knife for little tasks, but why bother when a little knife works just as well?

The few times I need a large knife, I know ahead of time (camping trips) and always take a fixed blade.

Not saying that there shouldn't be mega-folders for those that want them, just that I have no need or want for them.

Is there even large enough of a niche market to justify the addition of another mega-folder? Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems that the market is already starting to spread thin between mega-folders.
 
Blade length: no more than 5"
Blade material: satin/polished VG-10
Blade gring: Flat ground
Blade thickness: 5/32"
Blade shape: clip or drop point
Handle material: I'd go with stainless steel(maybe textured?) for ease of cleaning/maintenance.
 
What Rex G said:

"A bit of personal history: I own one of the large 4.5-inch bladed Al Mar SERE folders from the 80's, and it has a massive old-fashioned locking system that I used to call "lock-back" but now the term seems to be "front lock." It is the one present on the Civilian and Harpy I now own. The main drawback of the old SERE folder is that the blade almost disappears into the handle, with only a nail nick for traction to open the blade."

I remember the original SERE. A friend had one. I loved it.

I'm also one of those who were campaigning for the XL Native ("Native Chief").

Also, the sound of a spear point or drop point Chinook sounds lovely.


I'd make a 4.5" to 5" folder with opening hole that approximates the original SERE Attack folder. I'd prefer micarta, but other materials could work well. It could look an awful lot like an XL Native, too. "Massive lock back" is right. Make the Boye Dent large enough to do some good (I can still squeeze the lock bar on my new Endura and Native III too much--the dents ain't deep enough).

My biggest Spydie is the G-10 Police Model, but I also own and have carried the Sifu and the XL Voyager, so I do have experience with big folders. I rarely carry them any more. I think 5" should be about the max and it shouldn't be an exercise in "Mad Maxness." The largest USABLE size for an average (knifeknut) person.

And make it "MBC" qualified fer sure, too!

Hell, just a drop point or spear point Chinook sounds real good, too.

Karl
 
Really ambidextrous, meaning clip reversible; and the option of point up, so that the clip attaches at the butt end.

Regarding this Boye dent thing, I can live with it.
I wish Safetyguy could show me how he manages to release a lockback by squeezing it, though.
I have tried and tried to release all of my lockbacks by squeezing, and I can't.
Can Safetyguy describe how it happens?
 
Ken, it happens under certain conditions, especially with my left hand and full hammer grip (gross left hand habits under stress).

I first found this out with my old Native. I swiped left handed at some cardboard (as opposed to thin air) and found I naturally went to hammer grip and was pushing in on the lock bar enough to slightly loosen (but not necessarily release) the blade. That got me worried a bit, even though I mainly slash with my left instead of thrust.

I also found this occurred on my old style Endura (plastic clip), although not as much. Lately, I found this also happens on my new Native III and my new Endura and new Delicas, even with the Boye dents. They just aren't deep enough. This appears to be a minor problem at best, but when in "emergency mode," I would like more "wiggle room."

It doesn't happen in saber or "paintbrush" grip. It seems to be mainly a problem with gross-movement, under stress (especially left hand) hammer grip. It is worst with the Natives, and not so bad with the Enduras and Delicas.

If a larger Native or other lockback were to be made, careful attention should be given to potential for hammer grip lock release, and other unusual grip methods (pikal, etc.).

Actually, it is up to each individual to find out what may or may not happen to their grip and their folding knife blade security under varying conditions. I recommend careful practice on "hard targets" under controlled conditions, and use of off hand as well. Things may change under stress, so find out early in training instead of when the SHTF.

"YMMV" and all that...

Karl
 
I'd be willing to settle for a mini RAD. Though I would like to see both. 5" is a long blade and more than enough for most things.

I think the design would be improved with a blade hole, vs a stud, the low profile one on the Terzulo could be attached to the knife shown above, without a hickup.
.
I don't know if Laci would do a colaboration. I hope so.

I still don't get what is un-ambi about a liner lock. I don't care how I put it away, as long as it is equaly easy to open. I do see that a liner lock isn't bilateraly symetrical, but that doesn't bother me as long as it is BL operational. For the ones I have, I can open and close them equaly well with either hand, except closing with my left hand which is a little clumsy, but not enough of a problem for me to give up the stronger lock.
 
Generally, I think a Spyderco Mega Folder should have S30V steel, g-10 handles and a compression lock with a blade probably no longer than 5". If possible the lock should be MBC rated.

Specifically, I think Mike Snody's 4.75" Reactor is probably the sharpest looking mega folder I have seen. That Reactor would also have the advantages of sharing designs and philosophies with the forthcoming 3" Yojimbo and the maybe 3.75" - 4" Yojimbo that Sal hinted may happen.

G3
 
Well, giant folders might not be a necessity, but don't forget that they are a lot of fun! :D

Basically I'd like to see a Big Temperance.
-Blade style like the Temperance fixed blade.
-5" or so blade length
-Flat ground
-440V
-Compression Lock
-Ergonomic G-10 handle like the Lil Temperance with deep finger choil like the Native
-Lil Temperance style reversible clip
 
I've always wondered why you don't make the Large Lum Chinese Folder. The blade is under 4" and it carries just as easily as any folder. Here's what it would look like (top to bottom): Spyderco Production on top. Bob's Custom Medium in Ti. Bob's Custom Large in Ti. And Bob's Custom Large in Green G-10 with 440V blade.
 
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