Steve, I'll be happy to give you my opinion on any question you want to raise, I've got nothing to hide.
Originally posted by Steve Harvey:
Spark, you are so critical of explanations, lets hear your explanation. Why do Mad Dog knives in your observation, and in the observation of the half dozen or so others you mentioned, do so poorly while the knives in the hands of hundreds of satisfied customers, many of them military and law enforcement professionals, perform so well? ]
Probably because 99% of the people out there who own Mad Dog knives, aren't using them anywhere near their "advertised" limits. The ones who do use them and don't have problems don't need to complain - they got a product that met their expectations (something we all want when we make a purchase). Don't mistake silence for satisfaction.
I'm a big believer in the "10-0-1" law of customer service, here's a short explanation about it - If you get good customer service, you will tell 10 people about it. If you get average service, you'll tell no one. If you get bad service, you'll tell 1 person about it. Notice the disparity in numbers....
Anyhow, back to how well his knives do in the hands of military / law enforcement - how many military and law enforcement people actually
use his knives? Mad Dog is on record as saying that the Panther is popular among Apache pilots, wow, I didn't realize how similar a pilot's job was to a infantryman's! How many law enforcement officers use Mad Dog knives? Outside of a SWAT team, I can't remember having heard too many uniformed officers carrying fixed blades...
If all your knife is going to do is sit in a sheath, then it's easy to say it's great. When it doesn't perform when you need it, that's when the real bitching takes place. If the military liked it so much, why isn't it still issued to the SEALs? After all, isn't it a SEAL ATAK? Didn't it do so well in the trials that it blew away the competition? If it was that great, the Navy would still want it, right? Unless they found that it didn't live up to it's claims.... hmmmmm.
I am sure all those you mentioned are just as objective as your are. I am sure they all put their personal feelings completely behind them when they think and write about Mad Dog knives just like you do. That just makes it seem all the more odd doesn't it? ]
Nope, not really. I've noticed an amazing willingness to ignore the obvious and suspend disbelief from some of the Mad Dog customers. Not to mention an amazing ability to fabricate stories to discredit the facts.
I can't claim total objectivity. I never have. However, I am more than willing to argue any points brought up.
I think I'm in a pretty unique position, Steve. After all, I was the only person out there defending Mad Dog for a good 6 months, back when I first got into the online knife scene. I'm the one who was on rec.knives, RecDotKnives.com, and started the CFKAT / Knifeforums after all... I watched what happened, and I've watched the web of lies being spun.
Unlike you, I've seen it for what it is.
How do you explain it Spark? What is your explanation for all the satisfied Mad Dog owners out here? Mad Dog gave us all free knives, and we are all so grateful to have these lousy knives we keep our mouths shut about the edges chipping and the hard chrome blistering? We are all so ashamed of having been so expensively duped that we don't even dare return the knives to the dealers? Oh, I know, we are all so afraid of getting a tongue lashing from Mad Dog, we don't dare say a bad word about his knives, right? Those are brilliant, Spark. Give us some more.
Steve, take a look around you. Count how many people there are, crowding around the Mad Dog banner. Look for who is missing, who used to be so vocal. There are more than a few faces missing these days... and they were "satisfied customers". I see a lot of Mad Dog owners who never use their knives past kitchen work, and a few Mad Dog dealers.
Again, when all your knife does is sit in it's sheath, or cut air, it's easy to say it's the best thing ever. When you actually use it and it doesn't live up to the claims... that's another story.
The ones who did complain sure got great service... I remember exactly how many of them were treated. I mean, when you are called a liar, and are publicly ridiculed by the maker and other customers, hey, that's a great incentive to continue on and get some resolution.
Steve, you need to get this clear - I've never said that Mad Dog Knives are crap. I've always maintained that they are good knives. My stance is that they have very real, well documented, problems. Oh, and that for what they are, they are expensive.
People like yourself refuse to believe that anything at all could be wrong with your $350 "investments". No matter what you are shown, you still believe that you've got the best thing ever, which is your right. But it doesn't change the facts.
Kevin "Mad Dog" McClung can't keep his facts, or his stories straight. If you hold up anything he says to any sort of scrutiny, there are holes big enough to drive trucks through. Don't feel bad, Steve, you've been suckered like more than a few others, and this isn't the first time this has happened.
Rather than disprove any facts, all I've seen is name calling and rhetoric from Mad Dog and his followers. Mike and myself have jumped through every single hoop possible, and yet, somehow, we're still making all of this up. It's too rich. We've done real world tests, and of course, they all have to be faked. Or biased. Or something is wrong with out methods.
Again, Kevin McClung is more than welcome to put his money where is mouth is. Send any current, in stock ATAK from any dealer and we'll test it against a Busse #7 and a Mission MPK, and post the results. Heck, send any Mad Dog SEAL ATAK currently in stock at any Mad Dog dealer, sealed, shrink wrapped, or otherwise tamper-proofed, and we'll do the testing at the BLADE show this year, that should eliminate any bias questions. What's another hoop to jump through, after all.
But I'm sick of all the BS. Please, come up with another outlandish excuse as to how we've missed some esoteric "truth" and are faking this. I mean, now apparently we've raffled off another defective knife from a "former Mad Dog dealer" who was "marketing and selling Mad Dog folders"... [giggle, guffaw]. Sure, and I have an electric rifle to sell you that I built when I was 4.
Mad Dog's ATAK isn't the best knife out there. Get over it.
BTW, just to clear this up - Nam didn't provide the original knife that caused all of this controversy and was RC tested. Nam just was willing to step forward and put his ATAK where Mad Dog's mouth was, when we offered to do a retest. Amazing how now he's suddenly a discredited, unreliable source, instead of before we tested... Oh wait, I forgot, that's SOP....
Spark
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Kevin Jon Schlossberg
SysOp and Administrator for BladeForums.com
Insert witty quip here
[This message has been edited by Spark (edited 01-25-2000).]
