My first Kizer

sechip said:
Yeah it really is a shame because i love the looks and feel of the knife in hand... if it only flipped!
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I'd be interested to see if yours is just defective, or if other folks with the same model also have a weak detent. I'm not a big fan of knives that are shitty flippers by design, like all the Hinderers I've handled. I always wonder why would they put a flipper on the tang if they weren't going to have a detent that would give you the snap to actually open it?

sechip said:
I called the dealer [which was a different one from other people i believe] and asked him don't you check your knives before you ship them out and he said yes he does but i don't understand how he could have let one out the door like this.
As soon as he gets the knife back i will be getting my funds returned.... don't want to chance another lemon.
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Well, if I'd have done that with Spyderco, I'd never ended up the Spyderco lover I am now. The first Military I received, new from an authorized dealer, was slightly defective and had to be returned. I've also seen lemons from other popular brands, I think it's just a fact of life.

My Kizer showed up sealed in a bag inside the box, so I doubt the dealer tried flipping mine before sending it to me. My little 3404 has a great detent, incidentally, it flips so well I didn't even nano-oil the pivot like I usually do when I had it disassembled.
 
evilgreg said:
Well, if I'd have done that with Spyderco, I'd never ended up the Spyderco lover I am now. The first Military I received, new from an authorized dealer, was slightly defective and had to be returned. I've also seen lemons from other popular brands, I think it's just a fact of life.
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I can relate to that sentiment - My first Kershaw, a Groove, was a POS. Ridiculously stiff pivot, blade play, off center towards the lockside, and this was NIB! I've had three since that were amazingly well-made with perfect glassy smooth pivots, rock solid lockup, and phenomenal flipping action. My first Spyderco, an Endura, failed to impress for similar reasons - but, again, it was one of those occasional QC slip-ups that I had the bad fortune of getting.

Come to think of it, if I based my entire opinion of a company off of the first knife I got from them, the only companies I would respect would be Cold Steel, Hogue, and Lionsteel, as the first (and every subsequent) knife I've gotten from each company has been flawless. Almost every other brand had a pretty bad first impression.
 
You know, somebody could easily verify the steel (or at least get a handle on the edge-retention properties) by shipping one of these over to Ankerson and having him perform his sharpening and edge-retention test.
 
EZ Bake said:
You know, somebody could easily verify the steel (or at least get a handle on the edge-retention properties) by shipping one of these over to Ankerson and having him perform his sharpening and edge-retention test.
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That would require spending money on shipping and having the knife sharpened and then used by someone else. That doesn't sound particularly appealing to me.
 
Comeuppance said:
That would require spending money on shipping and having the knife sharpened and then used by someone else. That doesn't sound particularly appealing to me.
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Well to be fair, I use and sharpen all my knives, so outside of the $5 it takes to ship the knive over to him, I doubt seriously I'd notice. I keep eyeballing these Kizers and really like a few of the models. I might end up buying one and sending it over to Ankerson just to put some of the "is it really S35VN" stuff to rest.
 
EZ Bake said:
Well to be fair, I use and sharpen all my knives, so outside of the $5 it takes to ship the knive over to him, I doubt seriously I'd notice. I keep eyeballing these Kizers and really like a few of the models. I might end up buying one and sending it over to Ankerson just to put some of the "is it really S35VN" stuff to rest.
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Ankerson is currently in recovery and not performing edge-retention tests. If you ship him anything, it may be a while before it gets tested, fyi.
 
EZ Bake said:
Well to be fair, I use and sharpen all my knives, so outside of the $5 it takes to ship the knive over to him, I doubt seriously I'd notice. I keep eyeballing these Kizers and really like a few of the models. I might end up buying one and sending it over to Ankerson just to put some of the "is it really S35VN" stuff to rest.
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I'd have no problem with him testing on mine, though I've only got an itty-bitty 3" model, the 3404A2 or somesuch, and I don't know what size blade his testing method requires. I haven't even sharpened it myself yet, but it just came in last week. Other than flipping the clip to tip up, it's the same way it showed up at this point. If he wanted to sharpen it to his standards and murder a large quantity of rope, I'd be fine with sending it to him.

I'm not sure what would be in it for him, though, as that would leave him guessing at the steel composition at best based on performance and how it sharpens, and who knows if he cares what steel Kizer uses or not?
 
chiral.grolim said:
Ankerson is currently in recovery and not performing edge-retention tests. If you ship him anything, it may be a while before it gets tested, fyi.
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Ah, I did not know that. Well that sucks (that he's in bad health, not that I can't get a test done). I wish him a speedy recovery.



Does anyone know the difference between the KI-404, the KI-404A, and the KI-404B? That particular model appeals to me, but I can't find any difference between them.
 
Bugout Bill said:
A new response from Crucible:


Description: CI
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Cool, at least we know that for sure (more or less) - I was pretty certain when I stropped mine, as it behaved much like the Spyderco and ZT S35VN I have dealt with.

S35VN, M4, D2, AUS8 and 8Cr13MoV are the only steels I can identify by how they strop and sharpen, but, S35VN is the easiest to identify for me because (at the risk of sounding silly) it feels different. D2 feels like I'm scraping a chisel across my strop, M4 less so, AUS8 sheds metal and polishes like crazy, 8Cr13MoV feels like D2 but less rigid, but S35VN feels like butter.

If I was sharpening a S35VN blade and did not use it afterwards, I would think S35VN was a cheap soft steel.
 
Sweet, it's the right steel :)
Now it's down to the heat treatment which could make a big difference. Hardness we could test ourselves but even that doesn't say everything.
 
Bugout Bill said:
A new response from Crucible:
Hello,



As best I can confirm, Kizer is buying our CPM S35VN



Thanks



John Shiesley

Regional Sales Manager

Crucible Industries 575 State Fair Blvd Solvay New York 13209 USA 800-365-1180 x9135 315-317-3207 (Cell)

john.shiesley@crucible.com www.crucible.com

USA Producer of CPM, Stainless, Tool and High Speed Steels
Description: CI
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Thank you again for doing this and it's a good confirmation.

I'm disappointed that we have not heard from Kizer directly even though I contacted them through several channels. Perhaps after the reception BF user Kizer Cutlery got here back in August 2013 they thought it best to avoid BF. Kizer is not alone.
 
RamZar said:
Thank you again for doing this and it's a good confirmation.
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^ Seconded :thumbup: Bugout Bill :thumbup: Also :thumbup: to Crucible for bothering to confirm it for us!

I also agree that it can be challenging for company reps on these forums.

In the other recent Kizer thread i noticed that some of their new knives list the designer, i.e. giving credit to a designer for his intellectual product. Well done, that.
 
RamZar said:
Thank you again for doing this and it's a good confirmation.

I'm disappointed that we have not heard from Kizer directly even though I contacted them through several channels. Perhaps after the reception BF user Kizer Cutlery got here back in August 2013 they thought it best to avoid BF. Kizer is not alone.
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Aye, for a forum of mostly adult male men, we sure can be prissy little girls sometimes.
 
Hi, Guys:

We are NOT avoiding Bladeforums at all. We are working on applying for our own manufacturer's forum to get started and a pass around for your guys soon after.

Please feel free to reach out to me with questions you have. I will try to answer to the best of my ability, and I will reach out to the other team members at Kizer if needed. This is also why we want to have our own forum so that we can address or at least acknowledge the questions in a timely manner.

Thank you.

David
 
Kizer Cutlery said:
Hi, Guys:

We are NOT avoiding Bladeforums at all. We are working on applying for our own manufacturer's forum to get started and a pass around for your guys soon after.

Please feel free to reach out to me with questions you have. I will try to answer to the best of my ability, and I will reach out to the other team members at Kizer if needed. This is also why we want to have our own forum so that we can address or at least acknowledge the questions in a timely manner.

Thank you.

David
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Thanks David for posting again and responding to my email and PM just now.

I'll quote you from the PM:

Hi, Ramzar:

we are working to get our manufacturer's forum started here, this will make it much easier to monitor the questions posted on bladeforums.

We order our steel from the steel manufacturer, import the shipment into China and produce the knives. More than that I'm not at liberty to disclose.

Thank you.

David Sun
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Kizer Cutlery said:
Hi, Guys:

We are NOT avoiding Bladeforums at all. We are working on applying for our own manufacturer's forum to get started and a pass around for your guys soon after.

Please feel free to reach out to me with questions you have. I will try to answer to the best of my ability, and I will reach out to the other team members at Kizer if needed. This is also why we want to have our own forum so that we can address or at least acknowledge the questions in a timely manner.

Thank you.

David
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glad you guys are on board to help strike down the naysayers & haters.im carrying my 401x alot lately,definitely like it alot. keep up the cool designs.
 
Kizer Cutlery said:
Hi, Guys:

We are NOT avoiding Bladeforums at all. We are working on applying for our own manufacturer's forum to get started and a pass around for your guys soon after.

Please feel free to reach out to me with questions you have. I will try to answer to the best of my ability, and I will reach out to the other team members at Kizer if needed. This is also why we want to have our own forum so that we can address or at least acknowledge the questions in a timely manner.

Thank you.

David
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Great--I look forward to that and wish you luck with getting it going.

In the interim, though, any idea when and where I'll be able to order a ki4423?
 
I understand about the weak detent now, thanks for the info.

Glad you followed through Bugout, and confirmed that Kizer is using S35VN blade steel.:thumbup:

Also happy to see that Kizer is pushing to start their own manufactures forum, great news!
 
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