RAT E&E Kit

Nice looking E&E kit. If the perishables aren't already dated, I'd use a sharpie to date them and replace every year or so. I have a bad habit of putting stuff like that in my pack and then not checking it until I actually use it. I'm trying to change that. Aside from meds, stuff like tape and monofilament ages as well--I'm putting a small piece of tape with a date on that stuff too.
 
Good point Rotte and I also agree that adding an extra compass to the kit would be a great idea as well.
 
The meds can easily last a year past their expiration date as long as they were not exposed to temperatures (a few times) well over the storage guidelines.

With Rx medications, with the same guideline above, if the pharmacy put an expiration date of 12/15/2010 on it, it will be safe for at LEAST another year after that. A pharmacy might have a large jug of pills in there and they damned sure don't throw them out every year but they put those labels with expiration dates on the bottles because they have to and because they make money if you throw your stuff away and have to come back for more! ;)

When you purchase Epi-Pens, do not accept ANY one of them that is not good for at least ONE YEAR from date of purchase, if they try to tell you they don't make Epis that last that long, go do business elsewhere. :)

So, if your Doc is an outdoorsman and he OKs your idea of having a real medical first aid kit and he writes you a couple pieces of paper out and you have a minor painkiller in there like Vicodin ES and Cipro, Penicillin and Flagyl, you can keep them for one year past the expiration date with the possible exception of the penicillin, you have to be careful with that type of antibiotics.
 
Anyone got a pic of this handcuff key, I know that's a random question, but somewhere it said it was disposable? Is it like plastic or something, or just a regular old key?
 
Spenceds said:
Anyone got a pic of this handcuff key, I know that's a random question, but somewhere it said it was disposable? Is it like plastic or something, or just a regular old key?
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There is a good picture in the original post. ;)
 
Cpl Punishment said:
OK, there's a good tip.

So, what happens to penicillin?
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There are a few medications and that is one of them, IIRC, that can develop some type of nastiness that is not visible to the naked eye but can cause heart problems. That's what I remember, I will get with Wifey's boss today and get the scoop on that and post it here.

Most medications are perfectly OK for about a year after the expiration date, the exp.date is NOT from the manufacturer! It is from the pharmacy...but that doesn't mean it's past due a year later...should be good for another year. It's not like shit has a timebomb in it anyway and it's instantly going to go bad on a certain date...
 
Thanks for the review; it was good. I've been thinking about getting one of these.
 
Having received my RAT E&E Kit, and replaced the cheapo compass with one that points North, I decided to take it appart and explain in pictures why these 11mm chinese button compasses are so bad and so unreliable....

Firstly, the smaller the compass, the more dangerous an air bubble is, because there is far less material to break the resistance formed by the presence of the bubble. So if you are ever forced to carry an 11mm plasitc button compass, always go for an air filled compass and not a liquid filled one. The 11mm liquid filled compass is the absolute worst compass you can buy in terms of both performance and reliability.

Secondly (and I don't expect RAT to take the blame for this), these cheapo chinese compasses have no quality control as we in the west would understand it, and RAT or any other reseller won't quality control what they resell either. These compasses are mass produced by people who don't have any interest in quality and are happy for their bag of rice at the end of the day.

ShiteCompass1.jpg


This is the dial from the RAT Survival Compass as included in the RAT E&E Kits. It consists of a wafer thin sheet of printed polyethelane with a little metal cup in the centre that sits on the head of a pin. So how does it point North? Floating disk compasses are all made the same BTW, regardless of size.

ShiteCompass2.jpg


The disk is glued to a conventional compass needle, and as you can see, the accuracy of the compass is determined by how well the old lady or has glued the disk to the magnetic needle. In this example, the variation between magnetic north and where the compass points is about 8 degrees. Of course you can't expect anyone manufacturing 2 cent compasses to quality check anything, and these things really do sell for 2 cents each when you buy them in bulk. Notice also that the needle has started to rust, probably due to the presence of the air bublble.

So the only question is, shouldn't RAT be placing US products that are quality checked in their RAT E&E Kits? At the very least, shouldn't they be putting in something that could be used in an E&E situation? If RAT already stock the 22mm button (for inclusion with the fire kit), for safety sake please start shipping the 22mm button in the E&E Kits in place of the 11mm. The price difference is miniscule, as is the space, and even if it benefits just one customer who needed to use it for real, it would shurely be worth it.

Some may argue, "Who gives a F in an E&E situation where your compass points?" or, "What does eight degrees matter? It's only an estimate." But when you add the erroneous effects of an air bubble onto the build in manufacturing error, you can be looking at some 15-20 degrees out. That is down right dangerous.

Suffice to say, if you guys wanna pack one of these little plastic babies as a backup, go ahead. It's your call. But believe me, it is the very worst possible compass on the market (until we get an 8mm model out of China that is).
 
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Who has these in stock, and how much are they?

Looks like a very well thought out and tested kit (best I have seen).
 
mbassoc2003 said:
If RAT already stock the 22mm button (for inclusion with the fire kit), for safety sake please start shipping the 22mm button in the E&E Kits in place of the 11mm. The price difference is miniscule, as is the space, and even if it benefits just one customer who needed to use it for real, it would shurely be worth it.
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Dude, what axe have you got to grind with us? We have been over this before. While you don't like the compass, the one I have carried for the last 6 months does indeed point to North. Maybe I got lucky? The point being we can include a 20mm compass but the QC may be just as bad. I know what we need to do: Include a 60 dollar Brunton compass and that should fix the issue. Anyone worth their salt when it comes to maintaining an small kit is going to check their components regularly. Some folks are even going to add to or take away. We will be MORE THAN HAPPY to provide the best compass in the business if someone wants to pay the price.

So, what you are implying is RAT will be responsible if someone cannot survive because of their gear being faulty?

BTW: it's not a 22mm compass, it is a 20mm compass and to quote you directly: "Floating disk compasses are all made the same BTW, regardless of size." So they're all useless according to that statement or either you are contradicting yourself.

Bottom line to me, is if I bought an E&E kit I would put my own high-quality compass in there and have the button compass as a backup, but we have already gone over this before, but apparently you were not happy with that.
 
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87Burban said:
Who has these in stock, and how much are they?

Looks like a very well thought out and tested kit (best I have seen).
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KSF has them among other RAT Dealers,
I love my RAT E&E Advanced kit I purchased from KSF :D Great Kit with quality items... IMO
 
Just BEWARE OF THE COMPASS. It will kill you! :D :D
 
R.A.T. said:
Just BEWARE OF THE COMPASS. It will kill you! :D :D
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:D LOL , Killer Tomatoes,now killer compasses... Sheez..... what next , Warning labels on Ferro rods... Don't strike inside car, House ,near flammable object.... may cause fire ,Somethings Require common Sense, Guess the Kit needs a choking hazard label too, Sir do not put Compass in your mouth ,you may Choke to Death :eek: :confused: :p :D
 
Tony,

Like I said above, we have already gone over this deal with the compass. I have 2 compasses in every kit I own. Anyone who buys this small kit should indeed back the compass up with another compass. We have already discussed that. I would also back up the small razor blade with a SAK or other pocket knife. It's a last-ditch kit. If it doesn't suit your purpose, don't buy it. I spent all morning in the Little River Wilderness area with nothing but this kit. Jimmy Dunn and I were scouting the area that we are teaching the week long class in September. As coincidental as this may sound, I actually used the dreaded 11mm button compass this morning playing around shooting a general course back to the fire road from the bluff. It worked. It's not fast and doesn't settle quick, but neither am I :D :D
 
If you ever get this way, Tony, come to one of our nav classes and we will have you good to go in no time. It's fun stuff and when you get decent at it, it becomes addicting to see just how good you can do under varying terrain and conditions.
 
mbassoc2003 if you are such a champ why did you have to buy a kit that was all set up for you already? It sounds to me like you know your stuff. So please start your own company so some one can bitch about your stuff you sell!!!!
What it boils down to is that you are just a bitter man who is not happy with what you got the E&E kit is for when SHTF and for what it is it is just fine.
 
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