Ryan Posey aka SPYfanman-Where is the birthday card (certificate of Authenticity) ?

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@ SPYfanman...

Personally, I'd be just as upset and would be asking for a deal reversal also. I don't know Sebenzas, even though I own one purchased through CRK, and would have no idea what is original and what is swapped, but as soon as I noticed the difference in color in the titanium handle slabs upon inspecting it in hand, I'd be very suspicious that something wasn't right...

I read the sale description. Sorry, but "NEW" is exactly that. It means unused, unsharpened, unmodified, unaltered, un-'frakked' with...and if handled or fondled, then with extreme care. This does not apply to only the blade, but the whole item...in this case, a folding knife. If modded, then it should be DESCRIBED as such with words as well as pix, and with what parts, and it is now no longer NEW, but is still unused...so long as all parts used to make the FrankenSeb are unused.

"FULL DISCLOSURE" means exactly that...a full accounting of anything wrong or different or changed with the item while in your possession.

Besides this, you should be including TWO birthday cards, shouldn't you? ...I mean it is now partly 2 different Sebenzas, isn't it? :confused:

One should not need a lawyer to do a knife deal... Do the right thing. Reverse the deal and move on.
 
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This is the funniest thing I have read. dinokay doesn't have to worry though. PayPal always sides with the buyer no matter who is right. It's bad practice if you're a good seller because you end up getting scammed for items but in this case that practice works out for the better party. He'll just have to wait and if PayPal doesn't refund him he still has his bank/credit card.
 
I hope paypal refunds the OP.

dino: new condition means recently manufactured, not unused. This is a widely accepted definition for New (or Brand-New). It means new in factory condition. Not parts replaced.

Do right by Dino, let go of your pride because it's sorely misplaced.
 
SPYfanman said:
I agree that CRK hands fits everything. However, they also do to the highest of tolerances which could mean that it is possibly the only knife to which one would be able to swap parts out on their own and have the utmost confidence in the knife afterwards. In actuality the lockup didn't change drastically, however, it was enough to make me feel confident in standing behind a knife being sold on the forums. All the upgrades were done BEFORE the pictures were taken, the listing created, and the transaction occured. If someone happen to like what they saw and wanted to purchase it, then I would feel confident selling it.
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when the lock up on a sebenza reaches the other side of the knife, crk will NOT send you a new locking side. they ask that you send it in so that they can make a new on for that knife. this is so that they can keep the tight tolerances for that specific knife. what you have done is against crk policy and voided the warranty on that knife. you very well may have sent dino a knife with a subpar lock up.
 
SPYfanman.........

Your continued avoidance and attempts to distract the forum from your misrepresented sales thread is hurting your already tarnished reputation.

You posted a knife for sale and described it as "New"

The description "New" means "as originally delivered/sold by the factory in it's original production form"

If the knife is refurbished, reworked, modified or altered in any way (including use) it is no longer new.........Period.

Posting photo's and claiming that the knife LOOKS new in the photos is no defense.

SPYfanman ,you misrepresented your product and essentially defrauded the buyer.

Return the buyers money to him with costs, receive the knife back and sell it for what it is.......... A USED, MODIFIED SEBENZA IN GOOD CONDITION WITH NO FACTORY WARRANTY.

Failure to do this will result in this thread perpetuating itself and further damage to your already fragile reputation.
 
I review contracts as part of my job, so it's second nature for me to pay equal attention to what is expressly stated and WHAT IS NOT STATED in a For-Sale ad. IMO this is a clear manipulation of wording to avoid a concise, accurate, and truthful description of an item. Do that selling something of value like a house and you'll get sued.

SPYfanman, if you want continue doing business with the people reading this, I suggest you own up to the issue and refund Dino's money + shipping (both ways!). There is no other honorable course of action.
 
SpyFanman,
Do you only buy picture books to read??
Pictures are only half of the sale, your description only validate's it.
Do the honorable thing and send the man his money back!!
 
Threads like this are always a bit of a mystery to me. Here we have someone who isn't expressly a scammer. He's doing what he believes is honest business (or quasi-honest) and wants to continue to buy/sell/trade on the forum. He likely made a mistake and now sees folks beating him up for it. I think it'd be useful to have a definition of terms stickied in the exchange area to avoid things like this.

That said, I think SPY should refund the buyers money in exchange for the knife. If no other reason then the buyer is unhappy with the sale (modified knife be damned). That's just the rule on the forum and its there to protect both parties to a transaction.

Folks on here need to cut SPY some slack as it does look (to me) like a misunderstanding on SPY's part; this would be worse if SPY were outright scamming the buyer, right? He didn't think the modification was a big deal and found that it was. Now its incumbent upon him to make it right.
 
Both parties are NOT happy, dino should have his money sent back and SPY should have his Frankin-Seb sent back, saying "new" when there is a warranty issue is a lie.

Per the rules of this site, there should be no hesitation on your part, send the money back to dino so he can spend it on a Seb that hasn't been modified.
 
Bottom line.

The knife was not new. It had parts replaced. It should have been sold with that full disclosure; it was not.

I hope the right thing happens. Buyer should get a full refund and the B.S. should stop.
 
This sort of rationalization in Spy's mind that the knife is new and unused after exchanging parts and rebuilding it, and then after being called on it, arguing that it's somehow just as good as new and therefore he can call it new and unused boggles my mind. His claims for this knife in his sale thread specifically says "This one is new and and has never been used".

Spy, it stopped being new and unused the moment the knife had parts exchanged out of it. Of course, you know this already.

I'd call Spy's deliberate misuse of "new and never been used", as he describes a knife that had parts changed out of it, so absurd that I would question his true intent to actually defraud the buyer.

"New and unused" can't have very many different meanings to me, and some folks here may have their own definition of its meaning, but new and unused could NEVER, in any way whatsoever, relate to a knife that had parts exchanged out of it for other parts.

The fact that we're here arguing over the meaning of new and unused with a guy who is trying to torture its obvious meaning using some pos lawyer's tactic, coupled with the fact that it has been a longstanding ethical policy here at BF that no deal is done until both parties are satisfied, shows me the kind of seller we're dealing with here.

I wouldn't do business with this character if he were to give his knives away.
 
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Hopefully PayPal will quickly make a ruling and refund the OP his money. The Seller does not seem to want to do the right thing and keeps digging himself a deeper hole with his "weaseling" of the facts.

We all know what "new" means, especially as it applies to knives. Anyone trying to change the definition or concept of "new" is only doing it for personal gain and to shirk responsibilities.
 
SpY, given the facts presented, you not only didn't sell a new knife, but you sold a knife that no longer even had a factory warranty due to replacement parts voiding it. Where the hell did you get the idea that it would still be considered "new"? If I buy a brand new car off the lot, but later find out the dealer swapped the transmission from a similar car, thus voiding the warranty, I would be (as I'm sure you would be too) upset to say the least. That's what you did. New means unaltered more than it means unused. A knife that has been altered, through normal use or by swapping parts out, can no longer be sold as new.

As far as saying "the pictures are there, that's the knife I shipped", well that's just dishonorable. Live your life with honor, take the damn knife back. I'll tell you like I tell my 15 year old, "man up." Do the right thing, not the technical thing.
 
Bastid said:
Bottom line.

The knife was not new. It had parts replaced. It should have been sold with that full disclosure; it was not.

I hope the right thing happens. Buyer should get a full refund and the B.S. should stop.
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I agree 100%

It is absurd that SPY is still trying to argue this one. Dude, just give the guy his money back - you sir, are wrong here.
 
ooitzoo said:
Threads like this are always a bit of a mystery to me. Here we have someone who isn't expressly a scammer. He's doing what he believes is honest business (or quasi-honest) and wants to continue to buy/sell/trade on the forum. He likely made a mistake and now sees folks beating him up for it. I think it'd be useful to have a definition of terms stickied in the exchange area to avoid things like this.

Folks on here need to cut SPY some slack as it does look (to me) like a misunderstanding on SPY's part; this would be worse if SPY were outright scamming the buyer, right?
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Thanks you. :thumbup: At least one person sees it from my point of view. Now, since everyone has their own idea as to the definition of "new", behold as quoted straight from Merriam-Webster Dictionary found here:



Definition of NEW
1: having recently come into existence : recent, modern
2a (1) : having been seen, used, or known for a short time : novel <rice was a new crop for the area> (2) : unfamiliar <visit new places> b : being other than the former or old <a steady flow of new money>
3: having been in a relationship or condition but a short time <new to the job> <a new wife>
4a : beginning as the resumption or repetition of a previous act or thing <a new day> <the new edition> b : made or become fresh <awoke a new person> c : relating to or being a new moon
5: different from one of the same category that has existed previously <new realism>
6: of dissimilar origin and usually of superior quality <a new strain of hybrid corn>
7capitalized : modern 3; especially : having been in use after medieval times


Nowhere listed are the terms, unaltered, unmodified, original, fresh from factory. Just the opposite - "original" is listed as an antonym of the word "new".


Nonetheless, it seems the general sentiment amongst forum members is that the definition of "new" should encompass the terms original, factory fresh. Or should it? I agree with ooitzoo in that the clarification of terms would be a good thing to be incorporated into Bladeforum's policy. I think there is nothing more to say on my part that hasn't already been said in my defense so the future of this thread will be in the hands of the majority.

In light of all the comments, particularly those more intelligent and respectful ones, two things will be carefully looked at and re-adjusted on my part in future listings to insure more pleasant transactions:

One, in keeping with Bladeforum's Policy, all future transactions will have to have both parties satisfied. If neither one is, then the deal is off despite buyer's rudeness, disrespect, and/or poor communication.

Two, now that sufficient light has been brought forth with regards to knife "history" vs "condition" and its importance to potential buyers even if it appeals to a minority and even if any changes have been made and can CLEARLY be seen, then they should be noted as well.

As far as this transaction goes, it is in PayPal's hands. I trust the good folks there will make the right decision and whatever they decide is just and fair, I will honor it, both in keeping with BladeForum's Policy and Paypal's Policy.
 
SPYfanman said:
As far as this transaction goes, it is in PayPal's hands. I trust the good folks there will make the right decision and whatever they decide is just and fair, I will honor it, both in keeping with BladeForum's Policy and Paypal's Policy.
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In Paypal's hands? It's in your hands.

What about the good folks here? What, you don't trust us in making the right decision about you ripping this guy off? BTW, deferring to Paypals decision to refund or not refund isn't going to change the fact that you have already pissed all over Bladeforum's policy by not unwinding the deal.

What's funny is based on your pathetic and twisted misuse of the definition of a new and unused knife, you should be allowed to duct tape a Mcdonald's plastic knife blade on the thing and call it new and unused as long as the duct tape and plastic knife are "recent" or "modern". You are a joke.

Where do you people come from?
 
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"In the spirit of full disclosure, there is a small scuff on the clip to which doesn't show up in photos. Knife will come with leather pouch, box, cloth, etc."

Full disclosure? Right... Anyways good luck with any future sales here.
 
SPYfanman said:
Thanks you. :thumbup: At least one person sees it from my point of view. Now, since everyone has their own idea as to the definition of "new", behold as quoted straight from Merriam-Webster Dictionary found here:



Definition of NEW
1: having recently come into existence : recent, modern
2a (1) : having been seen, used, or known for a short time : novel <rice was a new crop for the area> (2) : unfamiliar <visit new places> b : being other than the former or old <a steady flow of new money>
3: having been in a relationship or condition but a short time <new to the job> <a new wife>
4a : beginning as the resumption or repetition of a previous act or thing <a new day> <the new edition> b : made or become fresh <awoke a new person> c : relating to or being a new moon
5: different from one of the same category that has existed previously <new realism>
6: of dissimilar origin and usually of superior quality <a new strain of hybrid corn>
7capitalized : modern 3; especially : having been in use after medieval times


Nowhere listed are the terms, unaltered, unmodified, original, fresh from factory. Just the opposite - "original" is listed as an antonym of the word "new".
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If you read further down the same page from the Merriam-Webster dictionary:

Synonym Discussion of NEW
new, novel, original, fresh mean having recently come into existence or use. new may apply to what is freshly made and unused <new brick> or has not been known before <new designs> or not experienced before <starts the new job>. novel applies to what is not only new but strange or unprecedented <a novel approach to the problem>. original applies to what is the first of its kind to exist <a man without one original idea>. fresh applies to what has not lost its qualities of newness such as liveliness, energy, brightness <a fresh start>.


SPYfanman said:
Nonetheless, it seems the general sentiment amongst forum members is that the definition of "new" should encompass the terms original, factory fresh. Or should it? I agree with ooitzoo in that the clarification of terms would be a good thing to be incorporated into Bladeforum's policy. I think there is nothing more to say on my part that hasn't already been said in my defense so the future of this thread will be in the hands of the majority.

In light of all the comments, particularly those more intelligent and respectful ones, two things will be carefully looked at and re-adjusted on my part in future listings to insure more pleasant transactions:

One, in keeping with Bladeforum's Policy, all future transactions will have to have both parties satisfied. If neither one is, then the deal is off despite buyer's rudeness, disrespect, and/or poor communication.

Two, now that sufficient light has been brought forth with regards to knife "history" vs "condition" and its importance to potential buyers even if it appeals to a minority and even if any changes have been made and can CLEARLY be seen, then they should be noted as well.

As far as this transaction goes, it is in PayPal's hands. I trust the good folks there will make the right decision and whatever they decide is just and fair, I will honor it, both in keeping with BladeForum's Policy and Paypal's Policy.
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You claim to have learned something from this, and claim to change your ways, yet you still refuse to "man up" and handle this? You can reverse the deal and and submit to PayPal that you did so. If you now know that you were wrong in the description, why not take steps to make things right? :confused:

It seems that you still don't get it...
 
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