Sebenza 31 Lock Rock?!

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353 said:
Thank you, I really appreciate your objective view on this.

A lot off guys would be biased due to the fact that they spent the cash or simply because of fandom to CRK.

I would love to check this out for myself, but I'm not gonna drop 500$ to find out. My original plan was to get a small 31 insingo when/if they got out, but it's not gonna happen now.

This needs to be adressed by CRK ASAP IMO.
Click to expand...

I love my Crks, but I have to call it as I see it. No bias. I love knives. All knives. I just found my go to knife in a 21.
However, I have chatted with a few other BF members who I respect, and have found that some 31’s have this issue and others dont.
Could be a first run issue like on the Impinda.
Also, I disassembled my 31 and increased the tension, but it did not correct it.
Hopefully this issue gets sorted quickly by CRK.
 
Sharp & Fiery said:
I love my Crks, but I have to call it as I see it. No bias. I love knives. All knives. I just found my go to knife in a 21.
However, I have chatted with a few other BF members who I respect, and have found that some 31’s have this issue and others dont.
Could be a first run issue like on the Impinda.
Also, I disassembled my 31 and increased the tension, but it did not correct it.
Hopefully this issue gets sorted quickly by CRK.
Click to expand...

mine is similar to yours with what you describe. I’ve kept it and used it lightly around the house. It still worries me that this is an issue more on the 31.

I also sent CRK an email requesting a return about 48 hours before then had to close up shop. I’ve still not gotten a reply from them. I know they have closed but not responding to emails even now worries me.
 
Ptman2000 said:
mine is similar to yours with what you describe. I’ve kept it and used it lightly around the house. It still worries me that this is an issue more on the 31.

I also sent CRK an email requesting a return about 48 hours before then had to close up shop. I’ve still not gotten a reply from them. I know they have closed but not responding to emails even now worries me.
Click to expand...

Im hoping the case is that they will be looking into it when they reopen. Quite honestly, if my lockup was as secure as the Inkosi I have, I wouldnt be worried.

All the other CRKs (21’s, Zaan and Inkosi) I tested for flex, I have full confidence in.
 
Sharp & Fiery said:
I just found my go to knife in a 21.
Click to expand...

The 21 has been my most carried knife for 6 years now, because it is pocketknife perfection in so many ways.

It's really sad to see it going out of production together with the Reeves integral lock.

WnUWT1q.jpg
 
I am hoping they will bring back the (discontinued) ball groove feature on the blade tang like on the early Inkosi. I truly believe that this will fix the "problem" folks are having with the lockbar flex on this new model.

I feel a huge difference comparing my two Inkosi to my 25. My first production Inkosis will still flex a tiny amount when you strangle it on the "tabletop test", but it won't "bounce and click off the stop pin" like my 25 will. More importantly, they feel way more solid in hand.
 
Ptman2000 said:
mine is similar to yours with what you describe. I’ve kept it and used it lightly around the house. It still worries me that this is an issue more on the 31.

I also sent CRK an email requesting a return about 48 hours before then had to close up shop. I’ve still not gotten a reply from them. I know they have closed but not responding to emails even now worries me.
Click to expand...

First, I want to say THANK YOU all for the passion, breadth and depth of knowledge, and sharing your wisdom *and* supporting on my little Youtube channel!
As someone commented "welcome to the CRK family". Mahalo!
I am humbled in so many ways and wish you all health and success during these challenging times.
tl;dr My Large Plain Sebenza 31 Birth date: February 13, 2020 has issues more concerning than "lock rock/flex".
I don't want to fork this thread to another subject, so please advise if I should create a new topic to get feedback from other 31 owners, or other models, to compare and contrast y(our) experiences.
It could well be that I am unique in my issues and FULLY expect CRK will resolve to my satisfaction.
The companies reputation is legendary and why this was my "grail" knife choice.

fyi, I sent CRK customer service an email on 4/6/2020 reporting my issues that has sadly resulted in me putting my first CRK *$450* knife in my drawer :-(
The response was "
Hey Jack,

The best course of action would be to reach out again once we have opened the shop again. Hopefully just a few more weeks. Unfortunately, I am unable to properly assess the situation without being in the shop and being able to chat with my technician.

We will be putting out a media blast on all of our social media when we are opening again. "
Mahalo, - JackG Hobbies
 
4mer_FMF said:
J jackghobbies , I agree with S&F. Post here, or if you’re worried about derailment, start a new thread about your own experiences.

I’d like to hear them but probably won’t be venturing to YouTube or other social media for follow-up.
Click to expand...

No worries. Not trying to Spam or get views. It's a (expensive) hobby, not a business.
I'll just paste what I sent to CRK customer service and get everyone's thoughts, but I would really like to hear from those that have had hands on their 31 for a while as I found my experience has been on an emotional roller coaster the longer I have owned and opened/closed my 31. Sheltering in-place for over a month has given me a *lot* of time to fidget open/close.

One commenter told me they had the same issue - pasting their comment here rather than a link

"I having the same issues with my large 31. Also have a small 31 with no issues. My large 31 is driving me crazy. When I tighten the pivot screw, it’s really hard to open and when I back off the screw a little. The screw comes loose after opening it for a little while. I was so frustrated I send it to CRK to have it fixed. I just received it yesterday and now the pivot screw is coming loose again. I have couple of large 21’s that had never had this problem."

My email to CRK
"Dear CRK,

During these challenging times I hope your family, friends, and company are well. Unfortunately, I need to reach out for some customer service help regarding my first Chris Reeves knife purchase. After a lot of troubleshooting (see below) I believe the pivot screw, pivot bushing, and possibly the ceramic ball interface have issues which I can not resolve on my own. As such, I need your advice on how to proceed.


Background:

. Placed pre-order with KnifeCenter in Nov. 2019
. Large Sebenza 31 Plain Ship Date: 2-Mar-2020
. CRK Birthdate: February 13, 2020
. The Pivot screw comes loose after many opening/closing.
.. You can easily reproduce the issue by repeatedly opening to a point just prior to lock up and then almost closing completely, over and over again.
.. If you fully open/deploy/lock-up and close completely, the screw will eventually come loose, but it takes a lot longer to reproduce (~100+ times). But in any case, it comes loose.
.. I ensured there was no lubrication on the male or female screw via disassemblies.
.. I switched the screw with a different body screw and that seemed to work better, but still came loose after a hundred-ish openings. Btw, why is one of the body screws smaller than the other two?
.. If I securely tighten down the pivot screw (without stripping it). The deployment is near impossible. I was told by several commenters on Bladeforums.com that the pivot bushing ensures this should not be the case and not to use loctite to resolve.
. Per suggestions on Bladeforums.com I tried disassembly, cleaning, different lubricants, ensuring the washers are not pinched. I followed instructions to the letter on Chris Reeve website and video method: How To Clean Your Sebenza: <removed link>
https://chrisreeve.com/blogs/how-tos/how-to-clean-your-sebenza
. In addition to CRK provided lubricant, I have tried Benchmade brand and nano 10w, to no avail.
. If the blade is deployed and I back off a little tension on the pivot screw, and relieve the lock bar, the blade drops pretty free, so I don’t think it’s a washer issue, The action feels & sound fine, so I don’t believe the issue is the washers, but this is my first CRK (grail) knife so I really don’t have any prior experience. I own *many* other high end knives so I’m not unfamiliar with knives.
. I have disassembled, cleaned and reassembled dozens of times and I have opened and closed the knife thousands of times so this isn’t a break-in issue.

I am at a loss and sadly this beautiful knife is sitting in my drawer when it should be in my pocket. Please advise.
Stay well."
 
jackghobbies said:
No worries. Not trying to Spam or get views. It's a (expensive) hobby, not a business.
I'll just paste what I sent to CRK customer service and get everyone's thoughts, but I would really like to hear from those that have had hands on their 31 for a while as I found my experience has been on an emotional roller coaster the longer I have owned and opened/closed my 31. Sheltering in-place for over a month has given me a *lot* of time to fidget open/close.

One commenter told me they had the same issue - pasting their comment here rather than a link

"I having the same issues with my large 31. Also have a small 31 with no issues. My large 31 is driving me crazy. When I tighten the pivot screw, it’s really hard to open and when I back off the screw a little. The screw comes loose after opening it for a little while. I was so frustrated I send it to CRK to have it fixed. I just received it yesterday and now the pivot screw is coming loose again. I have couple of large 21’s that had never had this problem."

My email to CRK
"Dear CRK,

During these challenging times I hope your family, friends, and company are well. Unfortunately, I need to reach out for some customer service help regarding my first Chris Reeves knife purchase. After a lot of troubleshooting (see below) I believe the pivot screw, pivot bushing, and possibly the ceramic ball interface have issues which I can not resolve on my own. As such, I need your advice on how to proceed.


Background:

. Placed pre-order with KnifeCenter in Nov. 2019
. Large Sebenza 31 Plain Ship Date: 2-Mar-2020
. CRK Birthdate: February 13, 2020
. The Pivot screw comes loose after many opening/closing.
.. You can easily reproduce the issue by repeatedly opening to a point just prior to lock up and then almost closing completely, over and over again.
.. If you fully open/deploy/lock-up and close completely, the screw will eventually come loose, but it takes a lot longer to reproduce (~100+ times). But in any case, it comes loose.
.. I ensured there was no lubrication on the male or female screw via disassemblies.
.. I switched the screw with a different body screw and that seemed to work better, but still came loose after a hundred-ish openings. Btw, why is one of the body screws smaller than the other two?
.. If I securely tighten down the pivot screw (without stripping it). The deployment is near impossible. I was told by several commenters on Bladeforums.com that the pivot bushing ensures this should not be the case and not to use loctite to resolve.
. Per suggestions on Bladeforums.com I tried disassembly, cleaning, different lubricants, ensuring the washers are not pinched. I followed instructions to the letter on Chris Reeve website and video method: How To Clean Your Sebenza: <removed link>
https://chrisreeve.com/blogs/how-tos/how-to-clean-your-sebenza
. In addition to CRK provided lubricant, I have tried Benchmade brand and nano 10w, to no avail.
. If the blade is deployed and I back off a little tension on the pivot screw, and relieve the lock bar, the blade drops pretty free, so I don’t think it’s a washer issue, The action feels & sound fine, so I don’t believe the issue is the washers, but this is my first CRK (grail) knife so I really don’t have any prior experience. I own *many* other high end knives so I’m not unfamiliar with knives.
. I have disassembled, cleaned and reassembled dozens of times and I have opened and closed the knife thousands of times so this isn’t a break-in issue.

I am at a loss and sadly this beautiful knife is sitting in my drawer when it should be in my pocket. Please advise.
Stay well."
Click to expand...

I also had the same issue with my pivot screw coming loose. Same thing. If i snug it up, its almost impossible to open/close.
I think this may have to do with the new “stepped” stop pin. If those tolerances arent the same as the bushing/washers, it will throw the action off.
Also...my smaller washer is slightly “cupped” that really erks me. Noticed it the first time I disassembled.
You are right, an emotional roller coaster,
I want to love everything about this knife. Its so disappointing...
Like a teenage boy...CRK...premature release!
How did you not see this stuff in prototyping and testing?
I specifically own quite a few Sebenza 21’s because I dont have to loctite the pivot screw, they lock up solid and all the tolerances are perfect. Something is up...hopefully CRK can do something about it.
 
Hello all. I am a long time lurker. I haven't contributed much in the past but felt compelled to throw out a few thoughts. I have several CRK's that I regularly cary and love. I am however, less than thrilled with my new 31s

I have a small 21, a large 21, a small Inkosi, and a large Inkosi. I recently picked up a Small 31 PJ and a Small 31 Micarta.

I performed the " table top" lock bar flex test on all my knives. All of my CRK knives “flex” or “rock” when placed on a flat surface and pressure is applied on the spine. This, to me, is not a problem. Every frame lock or liner lock knife I own displays this same behavior. In my opinion, this test is not useful, as it does not replicate real life conditions.

The problem (for me) is with the 31. On this model the “Lock rock” happens with very little pressure. The 31 blade rocks or flexes while holding the knife in my hand and applying relatively light pressure on the spine. I cannot do this with any other CRK model. When this happens, I feel a distinctive “clicking” or “pinging” sensation. Almost as though the detent ball is sliding or slipping vertically along the tang. As of yet, I have not had a lock fail in hand, or on the table test.

Again, all my CRK knives flex or rock when doing the table top trick, but only the 31 displays this behavior in hand, with very little pressure. The 31 is the only CRK that has a clicking or pinging sensation when the lock bar flexes.

The blade movement and noticeable flex seems inconsistent with the high quality image CRK has so carefully crafted over the years. CRK consistently refers to “extremely tight tolerances” and “bank vault feel” as selling points, and as justification for it's high end price point. while the issues with the 31 are not catastrophic, and can be overlooked by some, they are simply inconsistent with the image and standards CRK has set for itself. In the past, I have never had a problem justifying the cost of a CRK to myself or others. When family and friends have asked, I simply hand my knife over to them. After they experience the smooth action and overall feel, I always tell them to “try and wiggle the blade” , driving home the solid and well built feel of these knives. Unfortunately, this is lost on the 31.

Moving forward I would like to see CRK stop referring to “lock rock” in the 31 as normal. It is not. In the 31 it is much more noticeable and easier to create than in an any other CRK model. To me it is inconsistent with the CRK brand and disappointing to me as a loyal fan and user. CRK needs to first acknowledge the problem. Find a solution. Then, offer that solution to the many of us who have spent good money on the first runs of 31s. I am truly happy with all my previous CRK purchases but unfortunately the 31 falls short of the exceptional legacy of quality and craftsmanship I have come to expect form CRK.
 
Nazo said:
Hello all. I am a long time lurker. I haven't contributed much in the past but felt compelled to throw out a few thoughts. I have several CRK's that I regularly cary and love. I am however, less than thrilled with my new 31s

I have a small 21, a large 21, a small Inkosi, and a large Inkosi. I recently picked up a Small 31 PJ and a Small 31 Micarta.

I performed the " table top" lock bar flex test on all my knives. All of my CRK knives “flex” or “rock” when placed on a flat surface and pressure is applied on the spine. This, to me, is not a problem. Every frame lock or liner lock knife I own displays this same behavior. In my opinion, this test is not useful, as it does not replicate real life conditions.

The problem (for me) is with the 31. On this model the “Lock rock” happens with very little pressure. The 31 blade rocks or flexes while holding the knife in my hand and applying relatively light pressure on the spine. I cannot do this with any other CRK model. When this happens, I feel a distinctive “clicking” or “pinging” sensation. Almost as though the detent ball is sliding or slipping vertically along the tang. As of yet, I have not had a lock fail in hand, or on the table test.

Again, all my CRK knives flex or rock when doing the table top trick, but only the 31 displays this behavior in hand, with very little pressure. The 31 is the only CRK that has a clicking or pinging sensation when the lock bar flexes.

The blade movement and noticeable flex seems inconsistent with the high quality image CRK has so carefully crafted over the years. CRK consistently refers to “extremely tight tolerances” and “bank vault feel” as selling points, and as justification for it's high end price point. while the issues with the 31 are not catastrophic, and can be overlooked by some, they are simply inconsistent with the image and standards CRK has set for itself. In the past, I have never had a problem justifying the cost of a CRK to myself or others. When family and friends have asked, I simply hand my knife over to them. After they experience the smooth action and overall feel, I always tell them to “try and wiggle the blade” , driving home the solid and well built feel of these knives. Unfortunately, this is lost on the 31.

Moving forward I would like to see CRK stop referring to “lock rock” in the 31 as normal. It is not. In the 31 it is much more noticeable and easier to create than in an any other CRK model. To me it is inconsistent with the CRK brand and disappointing to me as a loyal fan and user. CRK needs to first acknowledge the problem. Find a solution. Then, offer that solution to the many of us who have spent good money on the first runs of 31s. I am truly happy with all my previous CRK purchases but unfortunately the 31 falls short of the exceptional legacy of quality and craftsmanship I have come to expect form CRK.
Click to expand...

Thank you for summing it up so well. My thoughts as well.

Welcome to contributing posts to BF. :D Looking forward to reading more from you!
 
Sharp & Fiery said:
I also had the same issue with my pivot screw coming loose. Same thing. If i snug it up, its almost impossible to open/close.
I think this may have to do with the new “stepped” stop pin. If those tolerances arent the same as the bushing/washers, it will throw the action off.
Also...my smaller washer is slightly “cupped” that really erks me. Noticed it the first time I disassembled.
You are right, an emotional roller coaster,
I want to love everything about this knife. Its so disappointing...
Like a teenage boy...CRK...premature release!
How did you not see this stuff in prototyping and testing?
I specifically own quite a few Sebenza 21’s because I dont have to loctite the pivot screw, they lock up solid and all the tolerances are perfect. Something is up...hopefully CRK can do something about it.
Click to expand...

I doubt that the stepped stop pins are the issue as I am not having problems with them on any of my 21s large or small.
 
Silverstonev8 said:
I doubt that the stepped stop pins are the issue as I am not having problems with them on any of my 21s large or small.
Click to expand...

There are no stepped stop pins on a 21, large or small. There is a female screw side that goes through the scales, with a bushing around that female screw side with a male screw on the other side.
The 31 has a stepped stop pin that two male screws go into from each side.
The stepped stop pin is threaded both ends.

ETA: Maybe you are thinking about the lanyard pins on the 21’s?
 
Last edited:
Sharp & Fiery said:
There are no stepped stop pins on a 21, large or small. There is a female screw side that goes through the scales, with a bushing around that female screw side with a male screw on the other side.
The 31 has a stepped stop pin that two male screws go into from each side.
The stepped stop pin is threaded both ends.

ETA: Maybe you are thinking about the lanyard pins on the 21’s?
Click to expand...

I am talking about the stop pins. I have the stepped pins on a few of my 21s
 

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Sharp & Fiery said:
There are no stepped stop pins on a 21, large or small. There is a female screw side that goes through the scales, with a bushing around that female screw side with a male screw on the other side.
The 31 has a stepped stop pin that two male screws go into from each side.
The stepped stop pin is threaded both ends.

ETA: Maybe you are thinking about the lanyard pins on the 21’s?
Click to expand...

I might be confused on the 2 male screw statement. See assembly parts.
https://www.instagram.com/p/B-3ICdgjySp
Seriously never attempted to adjust tension from other than body screw side.
I think I have hope now to tinker with adjusting tension from both sides.
I'll let you know after a bit of time.
 
jackghobbies said:
I might be confused on the 2 male screw statement. See assembly parts.
https://www.instagram.com/p/B-3ICdgjySp
Seriously never attempted to adjust tension from other than body screw side.
I think I have hope now to tinker with adjusting tension from both sides.
I'll let you know after a bit of time.
Click to expand...
That photo does not match up with my 31.
My 31 has a stepped stop pin.
That photo shows a female body screw with a bushing...like a 21 has.
 
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