ZT hit its peak? Or are they just morphing into something else?

[bodog]

... then they are not out of touch with the normal guy.

We (the people who even know the name Zero Tolerance) are not normal. And especially the people who would've even considered buying a knife for $700. We knife nuts are not normal and it'd be a good thing if we could separate what WE like and want and what a "normal" person wants.

 

[RamZar]

They should make fancier knives for front line pimps and drug dealers. That is what I really want to see. ZT should stick to what I consider its roots and produce awsome knives for a criminal to show off to his friends as a piece of pocket bling. I think their hard use knives are really slowing down the company and the way the company is growing I want to see more blades with 24k gold inserts and diamond thumb studs. If ZT asked me I would tell then exactly the direction their company should go. I went down to my local hood and asked the local gangsters what they wanted in a blade, so how can ZT not acknowledge and pick up on this market! It's infuriating! ZT needs to respect OG Pistol Pete and get this done now! It's time to ride for the 5, 6 must die!

(This post is 100% sarcastic and ironic for those of you with no sense of those things)

Not far from reality!

My flashy and shiny 0606CF was approved only by Doctor Detroit (infamous fictional pimp) so I had to sell it at near cost (just to cover PP G&S and USPS Priority with Insurance).

 

[PURPLEDC]

... then they are not out of touch with the normal guy.

Hey now, logic and common sense have no place in this thread. They obviously are out of touch. I mean if one guy repeats it a thousand times thats just as good as a thousand people right?

 

[PC87]

The ZT 0350,030X, 056X (hinderer) are my favorite knives. I have been thinking this for awhile, that ZT has left is roots. I really do hope they go back to making knives like their earlier designs. I would love to see some more Hinderer collaborations or maybe updated 0300 series maybe a little bit sleeker with a drop point blade.

ZT knives did win me over with there 3xx, 5xx lines in the beginning. I have not purchased a ZT in years. I do wish they would "update" the 5xx line of knives as I feel these are really good working knives.

Hoping they have some "updates" and some new working knives at SHOT.

 

[bobpoptart]

We (the people who even know the name Zero Tolerance) are not normal. And especially the people who would've even considered buying a knife for $700. We knife nuts are not normal and it'd be a good thing if we could separate what WE like and want and what a "normal" person wants.

So, you're saying they should produce knives for people who don't even know the name Zero Tolerance? That doesn't make much sense, none really.

 

[unklfranco]

Dang I just love the 0350. A knife I owned and sold. I'm glad they keep giving me extra chances to re-buy it. Plain ol S30v with a recurve "I" can sharpen is good to go. I stopped caring about its weight. I just want my buddy back.

 

[RamZar]

I listened to it. Didn't offer any significant insights. Though the pictures of the factory and different WIP pictures were cool.

And point isn't that ZT should already be catering to all of these people. It's that they made their bones on that premise and could expand into that territory. Even if they don't make a heap of money it'd give something needed to the people they stood upon to get their business up and going. I know a lot of guys, including myself, who'd appreciate it. And I don't expect people from outside that world to understand. But there IS a niche market. It IS empty, at least as far as a single company dominating it, and ZT could. I believe based on how ZT has operated it wouldn't let people down even if a little imperfect. And we do need some of these things and we need a common place to look. It gets old searching all over the place looking for just the right tool that is made to some kind of standard.

In that interview TW says something telling: "... the number of actual consumers that are going to spend $175 to $750 on a pocket knife is a fairly small group. It was easy to keep it exclusively USA. It was easy to continue to build products in that price point for these guys."

I'd refine that by saying that the core ZT production models are in the $160 to $240 range. Their most expensive production model is 0804CF which goes for $280 with full DLC, CF and CTS-204P. Beyond $280 are what I call discretionary knives.

 

[bodog]

One thing to be put on behalf of ZT is that they make good knives, with good materials and offer them at competitive prices

As any company they have to adapt their offer to fit the market

One may regrets they "dilute" some of they soul in the process but it may be a price to pay to grow...

And I'm contending that's not an absolute truth. Maybe to some extent, but not absolute. Even otherwise great charities take some off the top to pay their executives a large salary. KAI could put something good into pockets and pouches and sheaths of those they stood on to make a name for themselves. No one would complain. Don't know why that's an issue here on bladeforums. Whether they could produce anything and everything? Obviously no one can. But there IS a large niche needing a company to step in and offer American made products with a bombproof warranty for a reasonable price. But the issue is that there aren't big forums dedicated to this and there aren't many people who are speaking with any kind of real experience. Just a bunch of people who, for whatever reason, feel the need to speak when it doesn't pertain to them at all.

I can't speak for many others but I know Charlie Mike is outspoken and was in some real shit for awhile. I'd like to hear from guys like him, as far as simple tools and knives are concerned, what exactly he needed and wasn't provided or available. And to keep it reasonable. What can a company build here in America with a great warranty that would've made your jobs easier or safer or would have been helpful saving your life or that of another? Firefighters, paramedics, cops, military. Anyone whose life is dependant upon tools or could have used some kind of tool to save someone else's life.

These things are what I feel KAI could tap into and bring under one roof and honor their company's premise.

 

[marcinek]

We (the people who even know the name Zero Tolerance) are not normal. And especially the people who would've even considered buying a knife for $700. We knife nuts are not normal and it'd be a good thing if we could separate what WE like and want and what a "normal" person wants.

Who is this "we". I thought you were talking about ZT. If you are claiming ZT doesn't know what the "normal" non knife person wants....how do you know? Once again, I am sure they full well know what the clampack knifebuyer wants and have found that niche to be not worth their effort. I'm sure they know what the $10,000 full custom buyer wants too, and have found it to be not worth their while.

I'm still not getting what leads you to the conclusion that you have found some market that will make them money that they are unaware of.

I'm still not sure what lead you to the conclusion that ZT fans are desk jockey trolls either.

I dunno. Maybe they (and who was it last week...Kevin John), are reading and will realize "Holy moley! This bodog guy is right?!? What were we thinking! Get Bob from market research and fire him!"

I just happen to thing they are both very successful for a reason. And its selling to their customers.

 

[bodog]

In that interview TW says something telling: "... the number of actual consumers that are going to spend $175 to $750 on a pocket knife is a fairly small group. It was easy to keep it exclusively USA. It was easy to continue to build products in that price point for these guys."

I'd refine that by saying that the core ZT production models are in the $160 to $240 range. Their most expensive production model is 0804CF which goes for $280 with full DLC, CF and CTS-204P. Beyond $280 are what I call discretionary knives.

That's kind of my point. They don't NEED to offer products that expensive. Not all the time and not for everyone. They could take it down a notch and supply real tools at reasonable prices that opens their market up quite a bit. I'm sure they'll do that if people demand it, but if people keep saying "NO! I WANT KNIVES OVER $180!" they'll keep doing it on their fairly limited basis.

 

[Mo2]

Not far from reality!

My flashy and shiny 0606CF was approved only by Doctor Detroit (infamous fictional pimp) so I had to sell it at near cost (just to cover PP G&S and USPS Priority with Insurance).

did you not see the 606BLK? i think this was from a South Korean dealer. not sure if they are going to be avail in NA.
its an RJ martin design and showcases the milling capabilities that ZT has.

 

[Mo2]

What designers does ZT primary use for their lineup? maybe they need another designer for field use?

 

[marcinek]

That's kind of my point. They don't NEED to offer products that expensive. Not all the time and not for everyone. They could take it down a notch and supply real tools at reasonable prices that opens their market up quite a bit. I'm sure they'll do that if people demand it, but if people keep saying "NO! I WANT KNIVES OVER $180!" they'll keep doing it on their fairly limited basis.

Again, and for the last time, honest....says who?

 

[RamZar]

That's kind of my point. They don't NEED to offer products that expensive. Not all the time and not for everyone. They could take it down a notch and supply real tools at reasonable prices that opens their market up quite a bit. I'm sure they'll do that if people demand it, but if people keep saying "NO! I WANT KNIVES OVER $180!" they'll keep doing it on their fairly limited basis.

The KAI production facilities in Oregon have limited capacity. ZT will always be Made in the U.S. with mostly U.S. parts & materials.

I had mentioned in another thread that KAI has a gap in the $100-$150 range. The Kershaw line maxes out at around $110. I don't think they're too interested in filling that gap with U.S. made knives. It could just be from capacity and financial standpoints.

There are a couple of ZT 0350 models which sell for $140.

 

[RamZar]

did you not see the 606BLK? i think this was from a South Korean dealer. not sure if they are going to be avail in NA.
its an RJ martin design and showcases the milling capabilities that ZT has.

I saw the 0606BLK and was one of the first to post about it. It's very nice looking and not sold in the U.S. market.

My post was about 0606CF.

 

[bodog]

did you not see the 606BLK? i think this was from a South Korean dealer. not sure if they are going to be avail in NA.
its an RJ martin design and showcases the milling capabilities that ZT has.

Thats a nice looking knife. I'd consider buying it if available even though I'm not a huge fan of all blacked out knives. Still looks nice.

 

[bobpoptart]

Don't know why that's an issue here on bladeforums.

But there IS a large niche needing a company to step in and offer American made products with a bombproof warranty for a reasonable price.

But the issue is that there aren't big forums dedicated to this and there aren't many people who are speaking with any kind of real experience.

Just a bunch of people who, for whatever reason, feel the need to speak when it doesn't pertain to them at all.

Just so I understand:

1) We don't understand.
2) There is a large niche with no voice.
3) The rest of us shouldn't speak.

Is that about right?

If so, why did this get posted here?

 

[RamZar]

What designers does ZT primary use for their lineup? maybe they need another designer for field use?

Currently, ZT has a couple of in-house designers and has collaborations with Todd Rexford, Les George, RJ Martin, Rick Hinderer, Ernest Emerson, Dmitry Sinkevich and Jens Anso.

I'm sure we'll see more designers in the future and perhaps as soon as the 2017 SHOT Show next month.

 

[ourgon]

I say again... ZT9 bayonet.



Bring it back.

(along with 80's speed metal)

ZT Mauser bayonet.

Emerson probably based his CQC-7 handle on this.

 

[RamZar]

Thats a nice looking knife. I'd consider buying it if available even though I'm not a huge fan of all blacked out knives. Still looks nice.

Would you pay the $650 dealer price for the 0606BLK?