Cold Steel Strider rip-0ff

[Cobalt]

The whole issue here is that Cold Steel has the nerve to call a man a liar, cheat, ex-con and yet rip off his design, all in one breath. There is no doubt that the CS is a Rip off of the Strider. And I don't care one way or the other what CS does, but to do so and then call the person that is being ripped off a liar and a cheat is kind of ironic isn't it?

Couldn't lynn have just left the personal attack out of his adds? And stated if you want an economical and tough knife similar to some other high end knives this is it...Instead he chose the a-hole path. Quite Typical.

Then again if lynn didn't do what he does, there would not be 500 threads having 10 pages of comments to them every time CS is mentioned.

 

[DocArnie]

The whole issue here is that Cold Steel has the nerve to call a man a liar, cheat, ex-con and yet rip off his design, all in one breath. There is no doubt that the CS is a Rip off of the Strider. And I don't care one way or the other what CS does, but to do so and then call the person that is being ripped off a liar and a cheat is kind of ironic isn't it?

I'd say this CS G.I. knife is a pure Strider parody - and this degrades CS even further. Customers generelly don't like such behavior, but LT didn't harm himself by this. Striders are knives for knife enthusiasts who get their information online. CS knives are knives for people who aren't enthusiastic and just want a working knife which they can see and buy in an ordinary store around the corner for a low price.

 

[whitie]

Isn't there a just a wee bit of an ideological contradiction between those two statements? What happened to "be postive about what you like instead of negative about what you don't"?

Let's be positive about my favorite knifemaker who apparently lied for years to the public and built his reputation on a grossly exaggerated military history, but that other guy is a fake!

Gotta love the hypocrisy in that.

I saw it exactly the same way. The apologists go on the attack and it's every dishonest knifemaker for himself. I admit I've lost respect for both knife makers over this flap.

whitie

 

[hardheart]

He that is without sin, cast the first stone....Who here has a spotless past...Who here has done something they are ashamed of....Who here has made a mistake...???

Mick screwed up, got caught, did his time, and started and operates a successful knife company. If you don't like Strider knives, don't buy them. If you don't know Mick personally then you need to shut up and move on.

Or maybe I can post as I please. Please do let me know when your permission actually does become a requirement of my forum activity.

I like knives and own or have owned hundreds, from different companies and makers and I like Strider knives. I like CRK knives. I like Busse knives. So what. It does not matter to you what I like and I don't care what you like because I don't buy for you, I buy for me. Why can't you be positive about what you like instead of negative about what you don't?

True, it does not matter to me what you like. But thanks for telling me anyway, that really added to the discussion. I am positive about what I like. I'm not talking about what I like in this thread. Go figure, I'm negative about stuff I don't like.

Lynn Thompson is and has always been a fake. He is a marketing agent. He's never truly MADE a knife. How about this...Why don't we get Mick and Lynn to have a grind-off to see who can make the better knife?

Because being able to grind a knife has nothing to do with the kind of people these 2 guys are.

 

[tirod3]

[QUOTEI saw it exactly the same way. The apologists go on the attack and it's every dishonest knifemaker for himself. I admit I've lost respect for both knife makers over this flap.[/QUOTE]


I don't see where Mick Strider has gone out of his way lately to taunt Cold Steel by offering a San Mai Tanto for $30, or claim it's a waste of money to buy the real thing.

And the apologists didn't dredge up the past and post it - which was a direct apology. That does makes Mick the first and official apologist.

So the respect I've lost is for the constant and vicious vendetta to bring this up by some who can't accept "I'm sorry." The anti-Strider jihadists have no mercy - they personally hate him, despite being just as human, and they have no dog in the fight. Wasn't their business to begin with. They just like to stir up trouble - nothing better to do.

Man up, girly boys!

 

[0234042]

Originally Posted by 0234042
So, let me see if I get this right:
Cold Steels knife is a ripoff of Striders, which is a ripoff of Emersons.

Yes you got that right.

Originally Posted by 0234042
Does that mean that Cold Steel also ripped off the Kukhri design? How about the Bowie. The Katana? Maybe the Scottish Dirk? Oh, and what about the Chinese war sword? Maybe they ripped off the fillet knife too.

No, you got that wrong. Because Ernest Emerson didn't design those blade styles. They evolved over time in the cultures that created them. However, the blade style that Cold Steel and Strider are ripping off he did design. Earlier I asked if anyone could show that Ernest Emerson didn't innovate that combination of kiriha zukuri tanto and bowie clip. So far, no answer.

Emerson's blade design is unique, immediately recognizable as an Emerson style blade, and no one here has yet shown that anyone else came up with that specific style of blade before him. If it's truly a new blade design, let's give the man some credit for being an innovator. That doesn't make him a "cult figure" any more than any other inventor who comes up with something new. Sal Glesser came up with a hole in the right place. No wonder he's had to patent it and fight to keep that patent. If he didn't, the Cold Steels and Striders of the world would have already been using his work.

Everyone's denouncing Cold Steel for "ripping off" Strider. Poor Strider Knives, they've been victimized by an unethical bunch of dirtbags. The truth is both Cold Steel and Strider are guilty doing the same thing to Emerson. If Cold Steel is a no good rip off and a dirtbag for swiping other people's ideas, the same applies to Strider.

Originally Posted by 0234042
Obviously I could go on and on, but the nimwits that want to complain don't care about that.

Obviously you could go on and on and I'd advise against it. If you do so, you'll continue to expose yourself a "nimwit" as you put it, who has zero understanding of blade design.

Y'see, this is why I rarely post anything regarding these kind of rants. Invariably, someone will not fully understand what I mean and begin to pick apart certain lines of the post in order to make their own point. So, let me address these and leave you all to go on and have your fun, such as it is.

Vaako, with regard to the general nature of this argument (who supposedly insulted who, and who's knife designs supposedly got ripped off by who) you, Hardheart, STR and a few others seem to be the only voices of reason about the whole thing. I appreciate the clear thinking you guys have brougt to the subject. My post was intended to point out that all of this is not worth the mental energy any of us are putting into it. Especially the whining about whether Cold Steel defamed Mick Strider or not. And unless Emerson, Strider, Cold Steel, et al have their blade designs copyrighted or patented then it's fair game for someone else to imitate that design in their product. Sincerest form of flattery and all that.
Lastly, regarding me having "zero understanding of blade design", you're welcome to your opinion.

 

[hardheart]

I'm sorry I committed an armed felony, I'm sorry I molested that child, I'm sorry I raped that girl, I'm sorry I smuggled drugs, I'm sorry I sold government secrets, I'm sorry I planted that bomb, I'm sorry I killed that person.

Well, I'm sorry, but if Lynn Thompson can be villainized for being a liar and a shady businessman with no ethics, then I don't have to hold a high opinion of someone whose actions landed them in the pen. Nobody has to buy CS, or not buy Strider-but neither do I have to respect Strider just because the guy making fun of him is a jerk.

 

[Vaako]

My post was intended to point out that all of this is not worth the mental energy any of us are putting into it.

Edmund Burke was right, 0234042. All it takes for evil to flourish is for good men to do nothing. That's why people are so worked up, I think.

The online knife community could let everyone get away with what they're doing. One person can go on building his rep as a military Spec Ops hardass, the other person can go on showing the first person up for what he really is (while copying his knives), and both of them can go on swiping the hard work and new ideas of someone else.

But people here feel that some behavior deserves to be condemned which is why the discussion continues.

So the respect I've lost is for the constant and vicious vendetta to bring this up by some who can't accept "I'm sorry." The anti-Strider jihadists have no mercy - they personally hate him, despite being just as human, and they have no dog in the fight. Wasn't their business to begin with. They just like to stir up trouble - nothing better to do.

Man up, girly boys!

Where/when did Mick Strider ever apologize for misleading people about his exaggerated military career, much less do so with the same gusto as he originally promoted himself? Could you please post a link to the "big apology"?

...and some additional links to all the threads/ magazine articles where he "outed" himself?

It's one thing to lie, sincerely apologize, and do everything in one's power to correct the consequences of that lie. That's how sincerity is measured. Mr. Strider doesn't seem to be breaking his chops to correct all the misinformation about his military career that seems to have developed.

To this day, Buck Knives still lists him as "...the best in the industry-former military Special Operations personnel Mick Strider..."

It wouldn't take more than one personal phone call from Mr. Strider to his partners at Buck to correct that misinformation, now would it?

...which raises another issue. If Lynn Thompson is scum for stealing American jobs with Asian imports, Buck Knives is just as guilty for having 15% of their knives made in China.

As I said earlier, the indignation on this thread is very selective. It's not a question of lies or selling out to China, but whether we like the knifemaker who's doing it.

 

[tidefan]

Or maybe I can post as I please. Please do let me know when your permission actually does become a requirement of my forum activity.



True, it does not matter to me what you like. But thanks for telling me anyway, that really added to the discussion. I am positive about what I like. I'm not talking about what I like in this thread. Go figure, I'm negative about stuff I don't like.



Because being able to grind a knife has nothing to do with the kind of people these 2 guys are.

I don't know you at all, so I can call you a bloated asshat and that should be okay huh? I'm not trying to tell anybody what to do and I thought I was being civil, but I can play too fucktard!!!!!!!!

I've collected knives for about 35 years, studied metallurgy in college and make a few knives here and there...what are your credentials mr. keyboard commando??

And at least grinding knives would show who REAL knifemakers are....

 

[hardheart]

doesn't bother me in the least, but it's against forum rules outside of the ones specified for such language

I've collected about 15, only studied what I've found so far in pdfs, e-books, and posts/articles by knifemakers, and I've only made a couple of knives so far. I have 16 lbs of 52100 sitting next to me, and I'm going to start on the forge soon, still need something suitable for an anvil. I don't know what making knives and keyboard commando'ing have to do with each other, but I have a couple years in the military too, nothing significant.

Look no further than this board for real knifemakers-Allan Blade, Steve Corkum, Dale Reif, etc. A real knifemaker can be or become a real crook quite easily. I have no reason to trust either of the men being discussed, but I can enjoy at least a little more separation from the great white hunter, he doesn't actually make any of the knives he sells with his snake oil.

 

[tirod3]

I'm not selective - I bought a Buck /Strider copy and it's crap - I've said so. The 420mod/FRN has a bad liner lock design and I have the replacement to prove it. The ATS-34 has a better reputation, apparently. I bought a SnG because of it. Nothing to hide there. Much better knife.

As for Buck not changing their ad copy, it's their choice. That's part of the problem - many secondhand sources repeating lies, like "He lied about WMD's."

Hard to control in a mass media internet forum world. Please show me the links or ad copy where Strider did promote himself with much gusto. I hear a lot about it, but nobody posts it as much as his retraction. And the point there is, where in American Legalese is he required to use the words "I'm sorry?" I don't think I will pass court review, especially when the complaint specifed specific actions stop. LIke it or not, Jane Fonda apologized, too.

Referring to the "intellectual property" issue is a moot point. Lots of people get worked up about it, but industry history and standard is to copy anything with good sales that doesn't have a patent. The lack of any posting to report intellectual property case law is largely because it is a non-issue. Only the newbies seem to be worked up about it - hang around knives for 30 years and you have a more in depth perspective. I don't like it now, but in the past I saw it as a way to get the looks without paying the big dollars. Now I know better. All you get is cheap.

I'm letting this go - have a Fel Anon meeting with hardheart. (I know you were just making a point.) Seems this thread is going south and I don't want to be around when the infractions get posted.

 

[Keith Montgomery]

Nobody has to respect anyone else, or purchase anything that they don't want to. Each of us has to make their own decisions based on their own beliefs. What goes into my decision making should have nothing to do with what goes into yours. I don't have to justify my beliefs to anyone here, and you don't have to justify yours to me. If you want to purchase knives made by a convicted child molester, I will not agree with your decision, and will probably state so, but in the end it's your decision to make based on your own moral compass.

 

[georgegilstrap]

well read the here in doc arnies post apearently mick strider was doing to another what lynn thompson is doing to him. in the military we had a sayin what goes around comes around after reading docs post mick deserves what has happened so ill cut lynn thompson a break for now. eventually when you slander someone you open yourself up for inspection and mick strider went down in flames that dont mean his knives are crap i just speaks to his character. mick strider should appologise in full print in a cutlery magazine then this will probably die then we will know he learned a valueable lesson.

 

[3Guardsmen]

HEY PAL-MICK STRIDER SERVED IN THE ARMY RANGER UNIT, WAS WOUNDED IN COMBAT AND GOT A BUNCH OF MEDALS-

A certain rabid dog knifemaker has voiced that over and over, but it simply is not true.......He served, he has the medals to prove it........

Tom, normally I wouldn't care, but both parties chose to do all this in public for everyone to see (expecting that everyone will pick one side), so you need to explain one thing to me, without shooting me (I'm just a third person that is not involved and has to form an opinion on the stuff that is released online - were all a playball in a game between knifemakers/salesmen)
"Maddog" posted this "Strider quote" (if it really is one) in his forum:

Mick Strider hereby acknowledges that he has never been deployed as a U.S. Army Ranger. Strider also acknowledges that he has never served in or participated with SOCOM (Special Operations Command). Strider also acknowledges that he has never had any combat experience with any branch of the U.S. Military or U.S.Government Agencies, nor has he participated in any "Black Ops". Strider served in 2/75, but never graduated Ranger School. Strider lost all rank, was barred from re-enlistment and was discharged from the Military as a Private.

SKI will immediately cease and desist from holding Strider out as having ever been deployed as a U.S. Army Ranger, a member of or a participant with SOCOM, as having ever been deployed in "black ops", or as having had any combat experience with any branch of the U.S.Military or U.S. Government. SKI shall take immediate actions to correct any such representations currently made on its own website (see Exhibit B) and to the extent possible shall take immediate actions to correct any such representations by its business partners, including but not limited to advertising regarding SKI's partnership and distribution through Buck Knives.


Now my question: Is this real or not? If it's not true, how can "Maddog" post this without getting sued?
And please don't shoot the messenger boy.

As far as I remember, that was not a "Strider quote", but rather the finding/instruction of the Judge who heard the Osman vs. Strider civil case.

I, too, would like an answer to your question, DocArnie. If the stuff that is being posted on another forum, that was purported to be an official Court finding, is untrue, I would certainly like to know.

Regards,
3G

 

[SIFU1A]

after glancing at the stuff posted on mad dogs forum i did remember why i would NEVER own anything made by that "man", and was also reminded that imho most everyone involved in this bunch of mud slinging BS is an asshole.

sure micks an ass for lying, but imho so are most of the others, esp mr "mad dog".

 

[3Guardsmen]

after glancing at the stuff posted on mad dogs forum i did remember why i would NEVER own anything made by that "man", and was also reminded that imho most everyone involved in this bunch of mud slinging BS is an asshole.

sure micks an ass for lying, but imho so are most of the others, esp mr "mad dog".

I wholeheartedly agree!

Regards,
3G

 

[pit man]

Not to get drawn into the politics of all this I don't think Cold Steel should have said what they have...like a kid in the playground assault.
However for those of us who cannot afford Striders it does look a lot of knife for the cash !!!

 

[georgegilstrap]

it would be nice if we could get clarification on the matter. no doubt that cold steel should not have advertized like that but if the guy making the knife makes certain claims he should back it up. i mean the whole price issue isnt just with strider or cold steel thats industry wide whole salers out sell retailers by miles that should say something in itself a custom maker produces a blade and charges for his time and materials then some knife shop buys it and jacks the price up and some makers charge way to much as it is. what strikes me funny is that maddog and cold steel seem to be the ones that started this whole thing and i know for a fact that maddog and cold steel both tried to get military contracts maddog had the seal contract but could not produce the number of knives they wanted fast enough. the knife was his atak.

 

[automated ugug]

most everyone involved in this bunch of mud slinging BS is an asshole.

well said sir, well said

 

[georgegilstrap]

it seems like mudd slingin but all we want is clarification and it seem to have braught out a few other things that people want to vent the core of it is selling claims and practices. alot of people are fed up with it. look at emerson he had a two year wait on his cqc6 and then said he was having to increase it to three years while the whole time going to every knife show and selling out and the guys on the waiting list are the ones who gave a down payment at least he gave it back if you asked i know i was on his list got my money back and to this day will not buy any thing emerson ever.