Cold Steel Strider rip-0ff

[english mark]

Ask yourself the question.......If you or your 19yr old son was going into harms way, between the two knives would you take the knockoff GI Tanto or the Strider BT.

I can't believe some people are defending cold steel on this. Don't the knife buying public deserve better than this..... is this it......we're all gonna buy $30 knockoffs........Oh we won't bother designing a new knife, we'll just fob 'em off with this and we'll get some "experts" to talk crap about how this knife is obviously better than a Strider.....Yeah people who buy knives are dumb....they don't know any better.....And as a bonus we'll try and discredit Strider....Again......Wait till the Strider people see this....tee hee giggle giggle.....and maybe we can sell some of our cheap knives to soldiers going into combat and then we'll claim..."as used by Navy Seals" tee hee giggle giggle.

 

[Pete1977]

so LT's a fat little snake oil salesman liar and Mick Strider is a violent x-felon liar. truth be told, I don't like most of what either has to offer.

LT's knives are mostly knockoffs, if I wanted a civilian, why would I pay 3x the amount for Cold Steel's knock off civvie, when I could get one from spyderco that is 3x the quality for 1/3 the price, and an ORIGINAL design?

the only cold steel knives I own right now are zytel ti-lites, and an old ultralock with the grooved tang for one hand opening.

Striders are too rich for my blood. I have heard poor things about the fit and finish of strider knives on these forums, and refuse to pay 300 dollars for something that doesn't come perfect from the factory. I don't mind scratches, but I expect the knife to lock solidly and be sharp right out of the box.

both strider and thompsons personalities are abraisive and both I think make extraordinary claims of their exploits.

I WOULD like to know a little more about the car jacking though.

 

[Blackwind]

I don't know if links to other forums are allowed here, so feel free to delete this post if necessary.
Dave, I found this quote here.

And again, I have no clue if this is real or not! I'm not involved and have no insight in the whole situation!

It's real. It's also a matter of public record.

A) Yes, Strider is a felon and never came close to performing anything remotely close to what he claimed in his military career. That, is what has most peoples goat.
B) Yes, he grinds a decent knife.
C) Lynn Thompson is a fruitcake IMO and Cold Steel lost my business long ago.

To focus on the original post, LT acting like a child. Nothing new.

 

[Michelle]

...Considering both Cold Steel and Strider are both ripping off Ernest Emerson/ Timberline Knives "SpecWar" design......

I find this interesting. You have made several posts stating the Strider ripped off Emerson. Huh. "Ripping off" someone means you steal an idea/concept/design, etc., without permission, take credit for it, profit off of it, etc., with the end result being the person who was "ripped off" is usually pretty pissed off about it. SO, I am really confused at this point because Mick, Duane and Ernest are....... all friends. Not just that, they are in talks right now about a possible collaboration in the near future. How could that be? You are taking umbrage and making accusations.... yet the person you feel has been done wrong, has no issue at all. Perception and assumption is an intersting thing.

Strider's name used to be Berger, before he committed armed car jacking during which a weapon was discharged

Oh, so now the firearm was discharged? Man this story gets better and better every time it gets told. It reminds me of that game we would play in grade school called "Telephone Line". Where did you get this info? I hope it wasnt from that forum owned by that knifemaker whose resume, for years, claimed 7 years as a professional soldier... which then got switch to 5 .... which then was found out last year to be zero.... unless you count working in an unkown capacity for a company called Ninja Co (I shit you not), as being a professional soldier. Yea, that forum is a good source for accurate information...

I WOULD like to know a little more about the car jacking though.

Well..... that has been made public knowledge... from the horses mouth even... rather than 3rd party biased sources... but no one wants to bother reading or looking for that.... so, what do you want to know?

This thread has so wandered off the original path its not even funny.

Bottom line is CS uses deplorable marketing practices. Nothing new. What you have here is an unhappy person(s) who spent thousands of dollars trying to ruin someone's business (not the first time... Strider, et al., are not the first and wont be the last this has been done to), and it didn't work. So here we are...... over a year later, trying to stir the crap again because someone didn't get their money's worth the first time around.

This is old news. One side of it is moving on, continuing to do well, and grinding knives.

The other party is having China sweat shops grind knives based on designs stolen from a multitude of different makers, while he sits around slinging shit in print. I know which one I would consider to be a tradesman, and which one I would consider to be a parasite. But my views don't matter. Each of us get to have our own persepctive on the matter. What I would suggest is that people be a little better informed before they start casting judgement or jumping on bandwagons.

Have a good day all.

m1

 

[j.h]

I'd say your views "matter", Michelle.

First hand knowledge never hurts!

Kinda sums it up nicely, I think.

 

[darkestthicket]

And that is why i dont buy cold steel friends!

Edit.... Michelle, your the bomb. saved me the trouble.

 

[Pete1977]

Well..... that has been made public knowledge... from the horses mouth even... rather than 3rd party biased sources... but no one wants to bother reading or looking for that.... so, what do you want to know?

I searched and searched, and besides vague references on other forums, etc, I haven't been able to find details.

as I said. I'd like to know what happened.

 

[darkestthicket]

is[/I] a fact.

Yours is another opinion. some of us happen to like Strider's Finish.

i'd like to see thompson and berger/strider get it on, see whos the toughest man, who cares about the knives lol, i'd put $10 on mick.

Me too man. Me too.

You must have had some very efficient admin. One of my buddies in CA had a severe spinal condition, the vertebrae would shift side to side on him. He had a dead man's profile and still had to wait years for a med board. Then Jackson lost the med records and 201 of my friend with the stress fractures, VA just got him copies of medical a few weeks ago, even though he got out 2 years ago. He's technically a vet, but his chiropractor visits are being covered by his civilian employer insurance. I have a Marine friend who is hopefully going to see a specialist within a month, for fractures of the humerus in early '05.

Broken ankle gets you out in 3 months or less. i can testify to that on a Bible if you like.

I'm sorry I committed an armed felony, I'm sorry I molested that child, I'm sorry I raped that girl, I'm sorry I smuggled drugs, I'm sorry I sold government secrets, I'm sorry I planted that bomb, I'm sorry I killed that person.

Well, I'm sorry, but if Lynn Thompson can be villainized for being a liar and a shady businessman with no ethics, then I don't have to hold a high opinion of someone whose actions landed them in the pen. Nobody has to buy CS, or not buy Strider-but neither do I have to respect Strider just because the guy making fun of him is a jerk.

Im sorry, where is the post where LT posted his appology for being an aZZhat and dissing Strider knives in his crap ad copy? oh, there isnt one? that makes Mick a few levels up on him in my book.

Mick can admit his faults, and tell me honestly, you NEVER did anything remotely illegal when you were between 18-25ish? Tell me that and ill call you a liar, or a very sheltered individual.
Also appologizing and not meaning it and appologizing after you have reformed your life are two different things, you might want to consider that.

edited for language, readability and to not get another infraction.

 

[darkestthicket]

I have a question, why do some of you blade afficionado's buy knives that arent made in America (exception being regional blades such as katana or kukri etc) ? i just do not understand.

 

[DaveH]

I searched and searched, and besides vague references on other forums, etc, I haven't been able to find details.

It's on TF forums in a thread mentioned a page or so ago. in Doc Arnies thread.

 

[NorthStarXO]

I'm just commenting on the design aspects - really in this industry there are no "new" designs but just modifications of old designs. Everyone can put a spin on a design but most trace back to humble origins. Even wild designs like karambits and such have ancient origins with a modern spin.

 

[Pete1977]

I have a question, why do some of you blade afficionado's buy knives that arent made in America (exception being regional blades such as katana or kukri etc) ? i just do not understand.

Spyderco is top notch in design, excellent using folding knives, and absolutely fantastic in customer service. also, I can't remember Sal Glesser EVER making an ass out of himself on a public forum.

DaveH- thanks. I'll look again.

 

[DocArnie]

I have a question, why do some of you blade afficionado's buy knives that arent made in America (exception being regional blades such as katana or kukri etc) ? i just do not understand.

This is pretty OT. I'm not american, not living in america, but I do have american knives.
If you're all just buying american knives and nothing from other countries, well then 1. america obviously doesn't need my money 2. maybe my country needs my money more than america, because americans choose to only buy their own stuff and my country desperately needs some customers...

I can't stand this arrogant attitude. Noone in the world NEEDS american products - there are plenty alternatives from other countries - but everyone can choose to buy them. That goes for products from other countries as well.

 

[darkestthicket]

This is pretty OT. I'm not american, not living in america, but I do have american knives.
If you're all just buying american knives and nothing from other countries, well then 1. america obviously doesn't need my money 2. maybe my country needs my money more than america, because americans choose to only buy their own stuff and my country desperately needs some customers...

I can't stand this arrogant attitude. Noone in the world NEEDS american products - there are plenty alternatives from other countries - but everyone can choose to buy them. That goes for products from other countries as well.

I can respect what you are saying, being from another country, I am patriotic to my own as you are to yours . Didnt intend to offend the non-Americans. my bad.

Spyderco is top notch in design, excellent using folding knives, and absolutely fantastic in customer service. also, I can't remember Sal Glesser EVER making an ass out of himself on a public forum.

Can't argue with most of that, Sal has never said anything stupid on here that i have seen. sorry to drag thread off topic.


But again my question is WHY? not, "is Sal a good guy?"This wasnt directed at Spyderco.

This was directed at some of the cats on here that buy 500$ plus knives and still buy the cheapies made in other places as well. Not trying to be sillier than needed, just trying to understand.

 

[Vaako]

I find this interesting. You have made several posts stating the Strider ripped off Emerson. Huh.

Huh, indeed. Have you shown anything to the contrary? It's a pity you haven't weighed in on the most essential point of all. Maybe it's getting lost in the posts. Show me which makers before Ernest Emerson pioneered (much less popularized) the kiriha zukuri tanto combined with a straight clip back.

I've asked that several times and neither you nor anyone else on the entire forum has been able to answer that. Okay, Michelle, it's time to put up or, well, you know the rest.

"Ripping off" someone means you steal an idea/concept/design, etc., without permission, take credit for it, profit off of it, etc., with the end result being the person who was "ripped off" is usually pretty pissed off about it.

That depends on the person. You're making the incorrect assumption that all people behave in the exact same manner. Ernest Emerson is a class act. It would seem he's successful enough and "big" enough as a person to ignore the shameless and uncredited imitations of his work by Cold Steel, Strider, and dozens of import companies.

That doesn't change the fact that what they're all doing is wrong. If Lynn Thompson is scum for stealing a "Strider" design, then it's time Strider get tarred with the same brush because that blade design wasn't "theirs" in the first place.

SO, I am really confused at this point because Mick, Duane and Ernest are....... all friends. Not just that, they are in talks right now about a possible collaboration in the near future. How could that be?

Business and profit make for interesting partnerships. The US spent close to 40 years in a "cold war" with a communist nation. Communism was (and is) one of the greatest evils in modern history and responsible for the deaths of millions. At the same time, our greatest "trading partner" is a communist nation notorious for human rights violations. "How could that be?"

You are taking umbrage and making accusations.... yet the person you feel has been done wrong, has no issue at all. Perception and assumption is an intersting thing.

So is arrogance and presupposition. Please show where Ernest Emerson publicly appointed you his personal spokeswoman. I don't visit all the threads and this is a big place. I must have missed the announcement. After that, please show how you are able to know, irrefutably, what Ernest Emerson really thinks. Not what he publicly says out of professionalism (he isn't Lynn Thompson or Mick Strider), but what Ernest Emerson's private thoughts are about watching other companies make money off of his blade design without even giving him recognition for his innovation.

When you're done all of that, please show where I claimed that Ernest Emerson did have an "issue" with being stolen from. I never said he did or didn't. I said other companies were stealing his design. I never discussed how Mr. Emerson felt about being stolen from because I know better than to make the mistake you did.

Yours is another opinion. some of us happen to like Strider's Finish.

One is demonstrably over-priced, regardless of what finish you may personally like. Price comparison requires no subjective "opinion." One value is either greater than the other. Mechanical complexity and blade surface comparison are physical concepts. No opinion needed as one knife is more complex or one surface is smoother than the other.

So, let's compare. A Strider Mark 1 is a spearpoint blade with a straight, one piece "bar of steel" steel construction, and a length of cord for a handle. It has a heavy sandblasted finish. It costs $425.00 MSRP.

A Chris Reeves Project One is also a spearpoint blade, except that it has an incredibly complicated (from a machinist's point of view) handle that's hollow with a removable butt cap. In terms of of machining operations and skill, the Project One is an infinitely more complicated and difficult knife to make. It has a smooth, beadblasted finish and a black coating.. It costs $350 MSRP.

So the Strider is a dramatically simpler and easier knife to make, it has a rougher finish, and costs $75 more than the Chris Reeves. You were saying?

 

[DocArnie]

I apologize for calling you arrogant.
My point is, that the modern world doesn't work like this. It's good to be able to choose from a variety of products. Some countries, like the USA and China, can't live without exports.
China-bashing has become very "chique", but people often ignore how industrialisation started in their own, highly developed country.

But as I said, this is OT.

 

[DngrRuss1]

He put in the jabs at Strider because he was personally involved in hiring a PI to dig up dirt on Strider to defame him. (as was flamed endlessly about in the past)

And your proof is?

Or is this just another "I heard this, so it must be true"?

 

[darkestthicket]

Check the internet, its commonly know to those who cared to read it in 2002.

 

[darkestthicket]

more[/u] than the Chris Reeves. You were saying?

I was saying that your clueless. I like the finish, many people do, many people feel Reeves are comparable to Striders, I do not. Strider can pull down what he sets his prices at due to demand and has no trouble doing so. Reeve does the same thing, good for him. I have a sebenza coming i plan to test at which time ill be happy to let you know whether the strider or sebenza perform better. a "shinier" or "smoother" finish does not mean the blade is more or less overpriced. people pay more for strider's than the hollow handled Reeve knives and do it all the time. they like the look, the performance or the mystique, either way its the purchasers choice that decides if a knife is "overpriced" not YOUR OPINION.


Edit, my bad Doc, it was a low blow, due to high stress level today.

 

[Rat Finkenstein]

And your proof is?

Or is this just another "I heard this, so it must be true"?

Gee, you mean that you never were able to come up with evidence to the contrary, after so many months? Convenient. It is pretty obvious that he was involved.

So what do you have to say to defend LT's shameless theft of designs? Shill away.