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jaxurman: con
- Thread starter Will York
- Start date
This thread is getting WAY out of hand, with all the analysis and comparisons... Humor, inuendos, self proclaimed pyscho-analytical babble, none of it really serves a purpose.:barf: At this point I think enough has been said to easily form an opinion regarding Jaxurman. The above quote is probably the most offensive remark i've seen here! No matter how politely the author tries to dance around the term 'Fatherless Bastard', has only one purpose, to shock or attempt to Hurt Jax enough to wake him up.
A personal attack can be presented in many subtle, and not-so-subtle ways. Bottom line is it is still a personal attack :barf: You folks attempting to get a laugh at Jax expense are tossing the same stones he was.Being a semi-noob to the forum i might be stepping on toes that i wish i hadn't
I've visited this forum at least once per day since I registered, it really is a great place with a lot of really GREAT people, however some of the recent threads are what i would expect to see from a usenet group They reflect very little of what prompted me to become a member. The days of opening my browser to this community and knowing what to expect have ended. What used to be a close-knit group of friendly, helpfull, and FUN folks is slowly being unraveled! My Favorite place to browse and help quench my love of knives is looking more like just another place on the internet Productive growth of a community must be fed and maintained by its members.My intentions in this post are NOT to fan the flame, I'm simply expressing my opinion. Please do not feel, or see, any malicious intent.
Sharps
- Joined
- Oct 2, 1998
- Messages
- 15,223
I just want to hear yes or no - is the Jack Alvarez who wrote the articles the same as Jaxurman. Pure and simple.
There is a differance between having a collection of knives worth $100,000 , and having a $100,000 "collection" because you used to be a knife purveyor.
Seems like a pretty simple question. I want an answer.
Kevin
There is a differance between having a collection of knives worth $100,000 , and having a $100,000 "collection" because you used to be a knife purveyor.
Seems like a pretty simple question. I want an answer.
Kevin
wolfmann601
Gone, but not forgotton. RIP Ira.
- Joined
- Mar 12, 2001
- Messages
- 7,385
you are absoutely correct that you are entitled to your opinion. And I am absolutely correct in informing you that I absolutely disagree with your post in it's entirety.
BF has become somewhat of my second home and it is reflective of a community. No "community" functions in complete harmony and what gives BF it's spice of life are threads like this to keep things HUMAN.
I saw nothing offensive in that post. The term "Fatherless Bastard" was used to try to explain to someone with a head thicker than the liners on a STRIDER AR, and a fat swollen-head ego that he needs to sit down and "GET-IT". It is this type of analogy that JAXBLEWIT can understand. Any attempt to sugar-coat explanatins to jack are met with threats and degrading remarks.
Until you have been victim to an E-mail barrage demanding you buy a knife at an inflated price to prove your are an "HONEST PERSON" to Jack Alvarez, and then get called a skunk, punk, lowlife, pauper and other terms far more offensive after taking Jack's high-pressure tactics to the point of vapor lock, then explosion; only then can you understand that he still does NOT get-it.........ira
BF has become somewhat of my second home and it is reflective of a community. No "community" functions in complete harmony and what gives BF it's spice of life are threads like this to keep things HUMAN.
I saw nothing offensive in that post. The term "Fatherless Bastard" was used to try to explain to someone with a head thicker than the liners on a STRIDER AR, and a fat swollen-head ego that he needs to sit down and "GET-IT". It is this type of analogy that JAXBLEWIT can understand. Any attempt to sugar-coat explanatins to jack are met with threats and degrading remarks.
Until you have been victim to an E-mail barrage demanding you buy a knife at an inflated price to prove your are an "HONEST PERSON" to Jack Alvarez, and then get called a skunk, punk, lowlife, pauper and other terms far more offensive after taking Jack's high-pressure tactics to the point of vapor lock, then explosion; only then can you understand that he still does NOT get-it.........ira
- Joined
- Jan 14, 2001
- Messages
- 18,959
...Thank you for your well thought out posting, and I for one appreciate your candor, and well intended comments.
Agreed, this should not become a 'Bash Jack' free-for-all, and not many of us want that...hopefully none of us.
That being said, there are some 'issues' here, and in no set priority...
1. "Is Jack Alvarez a knife dealer?" I've bought from Jack, sold to Jack, and traded with Jack...IMNSHO, Jack is NOT a dealer. There are those that would disagree. There are those that have personal agenda's. I'm not one of those people.
Did Jack write those ad lib pieces linked above? Obviously not, he doesn't possess the grammatical skills to write them. Did he have them written for him, 'Ghost written' if you will? Sure he did, he told me so on the phone.
Is this hearsay? You bet, and it means nothing, says nothing.
So, is Jack Alvarez a knife dealer? I said no above, and I'll clarify...Jack buys knives because he likes knives. He sells knives to buy other knives. He doesn't buy and sell knives to pay his bills, at least based on a years worth of deals, emails, and phone calls I've had with Jack...he never once mentioned how much 'profit' he made, or where the money went...other than to buy other knives.
Again, IMNSHO, Jack is not a knife dealer...a 'wheeler dealer' sure, but making income from his knife transactions, income used to support his financial obligations? No, I think not,and I stand by that until proven otherwise.
Should it, on the other hand, turn out that Jack is 'Wheeling and dealing' for a profit, and that said W&D is specifically profit driven, then by all means, Jack should ante up his $850. That is only fair to the other folks here that are in business, trying to make a buck off a knife. Nothing more, nothing less.
The question arises though...how many bucks need to be made before a person becomes a dealer? I bought 3 Marbles knives, and 4 Gerber knives at one swap meet for $35 per knife...and I sold them on ebay over the next week. I made about $500 when it was all done and said. I bought the knives because I knew I could 'turn' then at a profit...I then used that profit to buy more RMK's...does that make me a dealer?
It was a one time deal, not a trend or pattern...but where do you draw the line? (Has Jack figured this part out? Sure he has...have you?)
*note: I don't want this to misconstrued to be a defense of Jack either...I'm so freaking pissed at Jack for his poor behavior here that I could just about spit...so, I'll try to keep this posting germaine to the issues at hand.
Question #2. "Should Jack Alvarez get banned from BFC?" For what? Being a snot nosed brat? If so, then ban about 20 more of us too...you know the names, there are a bunch of us pricks here...Jack just happens to be the worst...and that's only because he doesn't know when to stop, he doesn't type well, and he's an open book.
This isn't a witch hunt folks...and just because Jack pissed you off doesn't mean he gets an automatic ban...censored, yes, a ban...no.
What do I mean by censored? A one month ban, to give the 'offender' some time to think things through...and a 'pep' talk, explaining the 'whys' behind the temporary ban...this wouldn't be a 'hall of shame' public announcement, just a private explanation that the offending behavior was disruptive, and that a second ban would be permanent!
Here's an example...we took a co-worker and his 10-year-old son shooting this last weekend. It was our second time shooting together. I rewarded the boy with a Swiss Army 'Tinker' knife and an author signed copy of the 'Swiss Army Knife Society' book for his 'adult' behavior during our last shoot.
Towards the end of our shoot on Saturday, he violated a safety rule, and took a shot he shouldn't have...after I blew the whistle, signaling him not to fire. I had to tell him that his day was done...he had to sit out the rest of the day.
10 years old, and the kid not only apologized, thanked me for the day, and the lesson learned...he wrote me a letter apologizing, stating that it wouldn't happen again...I received it in the mail today!!! Now, that's adult behavior, and a response based on gentle discipline. It works, and everyone wins.
Sharps, we're not trying to 'hurt' Jack...no one here wants to hurt the guy, we just want him to play nice, play fair, and to think before he speaks, er types.
This is OUR forum...not yours, not mine, and not Jack's...it's OURS, all of US. And yes, we do need to discipline our own...that's the way it works in the real world, that's the way it works here.
Jack? Jack's an ass...but he's our ass, and it's our job to help him become a more productive member of OUR forum...
The bottom line? There are just as many pleased BFC members here that have dealt with Jack as there are pissed off members. Paraphrased, "You pays yer money, and you takes yer chances"
Only YOU can decide if going into a deal with Jack to buy/sell/trade a knife is worth the abuse/pressure/bullsh*t that you MAY receive in return...
It's your nickel folks, you may get a diamond...you may get a lump of coal...
--More later, my two typing fingers are getting tired--
Mel
Agreed, this should not become a 'Bash Jack' free-for-all, and not many of us want that...hopefully none of us.
That being said, there are some 'issues' here, and in no set priority...
1. "Is Jack Alvarez a knife dealer?" I've bought from Jack, sold to Jack, and traded with Jack...IMNSHO, Jack is NOT a dealer. There are those that would disagree. There are those that have personal agenda's. I'm not one of those people.
Did Jack write those ad lib pieces linked above? Obviously not, he doesn't possess the grammatical skills to write them. Did he have them written for him, 'Ghost written' if you will? Sure he did, he told me so on the phone.
Is this hearsay? You bet, and it means nothing, says nothing.
So, is Jack Alvarez a knife dealer? I said no above, and I'll clarify...Jack buys knives because he likes knives. He sells knives to buy other knives. He doesn't buy and sell knives to pay his bills, at least based on a years worth of deals, emails, and phone calls I've had with Jack...he never once mentioned how much 'profit' he made, or where the money went...other than to buy other knives.
Again, IMNSHO, Jack is not a knife dealer...a 'wheeler dealer' sure, but making income from his knife transactions, income used to support his financial obligations? No, I think not,and I stand by that until proven otherwise.
Should it, on the other hand, turn out that Jack is 'Wheeling and dealing' for a profit, and that said W&D is specifically profit driven, then by all means, Jack should ante up his $850. That is only fair to the other folks here that are in business, trying to make a buck off a knife. Nothing more, nothing less.
The question arises though...how many bucks need to be made before a person becomes a dealer? I bought 3 Marbles knives, and 4 Gerber knives at one swap meet for $35 per knife...and I sold them on ebay over the next week. I made about $500 when it was all done and said. I bought the knives because I knew I could 'turn' then at a profit...I then used that profit to buy more RMK's...does that make me a dealer?
It was a one time deal, not a trend or pattern...but where do you draw the line? (Has Jack figured this part out? Sure he has...have you?)
*note: I don't want this to misconstrued to be a defense of Jack either...I'm so freaking pissed at Jack for his poor behavior here that I could just about spit...so, I'll try to keep this posting germaine to the issues at hand.
Question #2. "Should Jack Alvarez get banned from BFC?" For what? Being a snot nosed brat? If so, then ban about 20 more of us too...you know the names, there are a bunch of us pricks here...Jack just happens to be the worst...and that's only because he doesn't know when to stop, he doesn't type well, and he's an open book.
This isn't a witch hunt folks...and just because Jack pissed you off doesn't mean he gets an automatic ban...censored, yes, a ban...no.
What do I mean by censored? A one month ban, to give the 'offender' some time to think things through...and a 'pep' talk, explaining the 'whys' behind the temporary ban...this wouldn't be a 'hall of shame' public announcement, just a private explanation that the offending behavior was disruptive, and that a second ban would be permanent!
Here's an example...we took a co-worker and his 10-year-old son shooting this last weekend. It was our second time shooting together. I rewarded the boy with a Swiss Army 'Tinker' knife and an author signed copy of the 'Swiss Army Knife Society' book for his 'adult' behavior during our last shoot.
Towards the end of our shoot on Saturday, he violated a safety rule, and took a shot he shouldn't have...after I blew the whistle, signaling him not to fire. I had to tell him that his day was done...he had to sit out the rest of the day.
10 years old, and the kid not only apologized, thanked me for the day, and the lesson learned...he wrote me a letter apologizing, stating that it wouldn't happen again...I received it in the mail today!!! Now, that's adult behavior, and a response based on gentle discipline. It works, and everyone wins.
Sharps, we're not trying to 'hurt' Jack...no one here wants to hurt the guy, we just want him to play nice, play fair, and to think before he speaks, er types.
This is OUR forum...not yours, not mine, and not Jack's...it's OURS, all of US. And yes, we do need to discipline our own...that's the way it works in the real world, that's the way it works here.
Jack? Jack's an ass...but he's our ass, and it's our job to help him become a more productive member of OUR forum...
The bottom line? There are just as many pleased BFC members here that have dealt with Jack as there are pissed off members. Paraphrased, "You pays yer money, and you takes yer chances"
Only YOU can decide if going into a deal with Jack to buy/sell/trade a knife is worth the abuse/pressure/bullsh*t that you MAY receive in return...
It's your nickel folks, you may get a diamond...you may get a lump of coal...
--More later, my two typing fingers are getting tired--
Mel
Originally posted by Melvin-Purvis
Jack? Jack's an ass...but he's our ass, and it's our job to help him become a more productive member of OUR forum...
I didn't know that posting here meant that I have a responsibility to hand-hold people through the basics of social interaction.
Maybe this was sarcastic and I'm just missing it?
- Joined
- Jan 14, 2001
- Messages
- 18,959
No James,
It's not our responsibility to "hand-hold people through the basics of social interaction.", any more than it's our responsibility to help a co-worker, a neighbor, or a stranded motorist...and if that's all you got out of my post, then yes...I was being sarcastic...
And Alec, no I wouldn't say Jack is my friend...unless you're using the 'Hatfield and McCoy' reasoning that "If yer not with us, than yer agin(sic) us..." I have no ill will towards Jack, other than the fact that he's pissed me off...but BFD, I bet you could piss me off pretty easily, and vice versa...
And Alec, I'd already told Spark what I later posted here, before I posted it here...out of fairness to the bonafide dealers. I think that it's a question better answered by 'management, the other dealers, and the makers' here...
Is Jack disruptive? Hell yes! Would BFC be better off without him? If he doesn't change his 'wicked ways', then yes, I think so.
Has he done anything here to get himself banned? No, not IMNSHO.
But then again, let's put this in perspective...I'm just one guy, merrily typing gibberish on the internet...
The simple fact is that Jack has outbursts. Many other forumites have had outbursts as well...though none that I can remember have had such a memorable run...
And, he has a very skewed concept of virtue and honor...dogging the living bejesus out of everyone that he feels doesn't meet 'his' standard, or that has 'wronged' him...so, that makes him a dick, but not a scam artist or fraud.
If you go back to the original post, Will stated that Jack had screwed up a deal that Will had pending...I think we all agree that that's the case...but that's the first time I ever heard that Jack screwed someone over.
The part that seems to gall most people here is that Jack has been particularly unforgiving of fellow forumites in the past for backing out of deals...or for not having enough money to meet their obligations on a pending sale.
Well, now the shoe is on the other foot, and hopefully Jack has learned a little humility from all of this, don't count on it though...
And yes, I'm still trying to teach my pig how to sing, and no, it's not working very well...but I'm not giving up, yet.
Mel
It's not our responsibility to "hand-hold people through the basics of social interaction.", any more than it's our responsibility to help a co-worker, a neighbor, or a stranded motorist...and if that's all you got out of my post, then yes...I was being sarcastic...
And Alec, no I wouldn't say Jack is my friend...unless you're using the 'Hatfield and McCoy' reasoning that "If yer not with us, than yer agin(sic) us..." I have no ill will towards Jack, other than the fact that he's pissed me off...but BFD, I bet you could piss me off pretty easily, and vice versa...
And Alec, I'd already told Spark what I later posted here, before I posted it here...out of fairness to the bonafide dealers. I think that it's a question better answered by 'management, the other dealers, and the makers' here...
Is Jack disruptive? Hell yes! Would BFC be better off without him? If he doesn't change his 'wicked ways', then yes, I think so.
Has he done anything here to get himself banned? No, not IMNSHO.
But then again, let's put this in perspective...I'm just one guy, merrily typing gibberish on the internet...
The simple fact is that Jack has outbursts. Many other forumites have had outbursts as well...though none that I can remember have had such a memorable run...
And, he has a very skewed concept of virtue and honor...dogging the living bejesus out of everyone that he feels doesn't meet 'his' standard, or that has 'wronged' him...so, that makes him a dick, but not a scam artist or fraud.
If you go back to the original post, Will stated that Jack had screwed up a deal that Will had pending...I think we all agree that that's the case...but that's the first time I ever heard that Jack screwed someone over.
The part that seems to gall most people here is that Jack has been particularly unforgiving of fellow forumites in the past for backing out of deals...or for not having enough money to meet their obligations on a pending sale.
Well, now the shoe is on the other foot, and hopefully Jack has learned a little humility from all of this, don't count on it though...
And yes, I'm still trying to teach my pig how to sing, and no, it's not working very well...but I'm not giving up, yet.
Mel
- Joined
- Oct 5, 1998
- Messages
- 5,400
( The following posts are in regard to me posting "Part" of an e-mail that I shouldn't have.) Again my apology ... started to turn into exactly what I am fighting against.
So let me just say ...
I have an e-mail now that confirms that Our Jack wrote those articles as well.
So he was/is a Dealer, Great.
Now what Jack? I couldn't care less if you were/are a dealer. All I still care about is your attitude. Also, an overall apology would be nice as well.
*However, if classifying you as a true dealer keeps you out of our hair, so be it.
Ryan
So let me just say ...
I have an e-mail now that confirms that Our Jack wrote those articles as well.
So he was/is a Dealer, Great.
Now what Jack? I couldn't care less if you were/are a dealer. All I still care about is your attitude. Also, an overall apology would be nice as well.
*However, if classifying you as a true dealer keeps you out of our hair, so be it.
Ryan
- Joined
- May 9, 2000
- Messages
- 29,205
Since Ryan has edited his post I will edit mine as well. If anyone wants to know why this has been done feel free to email me or, if you can, send me a private message.
- Joined
- Jan 14, 2001
- Messages
- 18,959
How does what you posted confirm that Jack wrote anything?
And...
Who was the original 'sender'?
And...
Who was the reply sent to, you?
Your post reminds me of the the following from Lewis Carroll's "Through the Looking Glass, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland...
Alice, just before she went down the 'rabbit hole'...
"Curiouser and curiouser" cried Alice, (she was so much surprised, that for the moment she quite forgot how to speak good English); "now I'm opening out like the largest telescope that ever was! Good-bye, feet!" (for when she looked down at her feet, they seemed to be almost out of sight, they were getting so far off)....kind of like this thread eh?
Man, you must really have a hard-on for Jack to post that kind of 'stuff'...(read: sh*t!)
Disgusted Mel
--edited, because editing seems to be so 'en vogue' tonight--
And...
Who was the original 'sender'?
And...
Who was the reply sent to, you?
Your post reminds me of the the following from Lewis Carroll's "Through the Looking Glass, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland...
Alice, just before she went down the 'rabbit hole'...
"Curiouser and curiouser" cried Alice, (she was so much surprised, that for the moment she quite forgot how to speak good English); "now I'm opening out like the largest telescope that ever was! Good-bye, feet!" (for when she looked down at her feet, they seemed to be almost out of sight, they were getting so far off)....kind of like this thread eh?
Man, you must really have a hard-on for Jack to post that kind of 'stuff'...(read: sh*t!)
Disgusted Mel
--edited, because editing seems to be so 'en vogue' tonight--
- Joined
- Oct 5, 1998
- Messages
- 5,400
Yeah, Yeah ... I know ... I stooped to his level.
My bad.
You want the e-mail, write me, not like it matters at this point.
This fight is going no where. Just people eating popcorn at this point.
Honestly this was all done for a good reason, now it's just kicking a man when he's down.
And two days later we'll see another post of Jack Attacking.
Nothing has or will change ... very sad.
(sigh)
My bad.
You want the e-mail, write me, not like it matters at this point.
This fight is going no where. Just people eating popcorn at this point.
Honestly this was all done for a good reason, now it's just kicking a man when he's down.
And two days later we'll see another post of Jack Attacking.
Nothing has or will change ... very sad.
(sigh)
- Joined
- May 9, 2000
- Messages
- 29,205
Boy, people are going to be really confused when they read these last few posts, but Ryan, I really do think that you did the right thing in removing that information. Too bad it was there long enough for some of us to read. Oh well, live and learn.
- Joined
- Jan 14, 2001
- Messages
- 18,959
...my friend, 'Roger that'...and sighing with ya here buddy...
The upside is, I've just about taught the pig how to make popcorn...lol
Kekekeke...
Mel
The upside is, I've just about taught the pig how to make popcorn...lol
Kekekeke...
Mel
- Joined
- Jul 4, 2001
- Messages
- 601
What i would like to know is why jaxurman will not tell sparks or anyone else what he really is in public forum does he have something to hide or not? no offence meant to anyone.
Lee Brooks
Knifemaker
BROOKSKNIVES.canada
brooksknives@hotmail.com
Lee Brooks
Knifemaker
BROOKSKNIVES.canada
brooksknives@hotmail.com
- Joined
- Sep 30, 1999
- Messages
- 4,229
What constitutes being a dealer? I believe Spark once posted clarification that you are a dealer if you are buying at dealer cost or wholesale prices and then selling for profit.
I believe Jack used to be a dealer but is NOT now. The question that muddies the water is: was his vast collection purchased at dealer cost? Is this the remains of a dealer inventory?
Melvin, you should consider writing comedy for Saturday Night Live
I believe Jack used to be a dealer but is NOT now. The question that muddies the water is: was his vast collection purchased at dealer cost? Is this the remains of a dealer inventory?
Melvin, you should consider writing comedy for Saturday Night Live
- Joined
- Jan 14, 2001
- Messages
- 18,959
I started to write a "Where's lifter' thread tonight...but got side tracked with this 'foo-foo' (I really do type with two fingers btw...lol)
I kinda figured that you'd been abducted by aliens (again), were on 'holiday', or had fallen in the sh*tter...
Saturday Night Live? Nahhh, those guys write much more interesting 'stuff' than I do...
Anyhoo, you're back, and you're on watch now, so I can get some zzzzz's
Speaking of which, it's late...I'm outta here
Mel
*poof*
I kinda figured that you'd been abducted by aliens (again), were on 'holiday', or had fallen in the sh*tter...
Saturday Night Live? Nahhh, those guys write much more interesting 'stuff' than I do...
Anyhoo, you're back, and you're on watch now, so I can get some zzzzz's
Speaking of which, it's late...I'm outta here
Mel
*poof*