Strider Knives, Game Over!

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711432 said:
If a company offers a product that the market demands (or creates that demand), at a suitable price, I can't imagine any act that would turn people away.
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I can think of one. . .

Dogfighting.

Based on the publicity over the Michael Vick scandal, it seems that dogfighting is worse than killing someone. ;-)

Outside of that, I'd generally agree with you, though. ;-)
 
711432 said:
If a company offers a product that the market demands (or creates that demand), at a suitable price, I can't imagine any act that would turn people away.
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And what has generated the demand and influenced customer preference for the Strider knife? Slab-sided and cord-wrapped stainless blades with tooling marks generally don't fetch their prices. If the marketing is based on a false image, that would potentially have an impact.

People might not care what an owner or employee does when it brings prices down, but this is a case where it could have spurred demand and shifted prices up. I can't imagine anyone that would be willing to pay more based on a false premise.

Why some people like to think military background has a single thing to do with making a good knife in the first place, I can't figure.
 
hardheart said:
Why some people like to think military background has a single thing to do with making a good knife in the first place, I can't figure.
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because it lends to one's credibility. if one has been in combat, many will believe they know what type of knife would best serve the end user in the same circumstances.

it also doesn't hurt the image one would like to see themselves as if they buy a product from a "distinguished operator" type. fairly simple marketing idea, which has taken off for mick and duane.

many may not care, but the masses will see them as products made for operators, by operators.


the reality is probably that, as you suggest, it doesn't matter nearly as much as is implied or advertised.

heck, my favorite knife maker is a scotch swilling, cigar smoking, and bbq eating family man.
 
wolfmann601 said:
How is it that only one very small document is the only one that fails to laod and would a computer geek type get a 0300 call to fix such an error?
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Here's where things get a little difficult, because I have no information about how POWnetworks actually hosts their documents and files. I can offer a couple of possible scenarios based on technical knowledge, but nothing more.

And, as for whether this particular situation is likely to get someone called at 3am, no, not likely. Not for a non-profit organization like POWnetworks. If they were a commercial business that made money off of making documents available and having documents unavailable caused a loss of profit, then they would likely be waking someone up at 3am (assuming that was when it was discovered) to get things fixed.

It's important to remember that the academic and non-profit sectors are much different form the corporate sector in this regard. Something that seems urgent to to a few people (such as those on bladeforums here, who couldn't access the document) was likely just one of many things the POWnewtorks people had on their plate. Because people here are not paying customers, and a minor inconvenience to us doesn't cost them money, it probably wasn't a top priority. That alone can cause a 5 minute fix to take a few days.

My limited knowledge causes me some difficulty so I must defer to you experts to explain how this happens and what they had to do in order to get this one small document to load. I am not that naive to have ever thought it would never load again, I am simply suspicious that it was "pulled" until they had a chance to make certain all their "facts" were factual. I never once believed it was a conspiracy, I honesty don't know exactly why it happened and thats why I wrote what I wrote.
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Okay, the first problem that we have is that we're dealing with extremely limited information on the situation. For example, I've heard it thrown around by multiple people that there was a single file that wouldn't load. Has this been verified? Are we sure there weren't more files that were affected, but we didn't know about it because they didn't interest us? I've not even looked at the POWnetworks site, so I don't know how many documents they have hosted there, but bits I've heard here suggest it's a fairly significant quantity. Doing a spot check on a few other files doesn't mean that no other files are affected, it just means that the sample was small, and that of the sample, only one was affected.

I would actually guess that multiple files probably were affected, we just don't know about the other ones.

Now, on to a bit more of how this might have come about. Someone mentioned that the POWnetworks people said something about exceeding disk space, which caused their account to be locked read-only and prevented them from making additional changes. If they happened to be moving things around, or did anything at all that would normally make the file unavailable for a few seconds at the time the account was locked, then the file would be stuck in that unavailable state until it was resolved.

A few other situations I can think of, off the top of my head, that might produce similar problems for end users. . . maybe the documents are stored across many different web/document servers, and the one that contained the specific document desired here had software or hardware failure. Perhaps the file was deleted accidentally, and had to be recovered from a backup. Perhaps there was no backup, or the backup was corrupt, and the file had to be recreated from a hardcopy source. Maybe there was some sort of technical problem and being a non-profit company, they didn't have the technical resources available to deal with it for a few days. As stated in the previous paragraph, these are likely not what happened, but any of them could have happened, and from our perspective, the results would be the same.

Personally, my thought is that since they were apparently e-mailing the document to anyone who sent a request for it to them, it's unlikely they were trying to prevent access to it. Additionally, we know multiple people here did e-mail them and request copies of it, so it's lack of availability caused them (or, at least someone there) extra work. It seems unlikely they'd intentionally do something to cause them extra work without some sort of gain (which I'm not seeing here). The limited explanation I've heard of the events, second hand, but apparently from someone at POWnetworks, seems quite plausible, and in the absence of anything that I've heard or seen contradicting it, I'm willing to accept it as what happened.

Hope this helps. If I'm unclear anywhere, please let me know and I'll try to clarify my comments.
 
The idea of a Knife maker having that Military background that helps sell knives is a comment on the buyers mentality in itself.
Most Soldiers carry whatever they are given, you could count on one hand in this day and age how many Soldiers use a knife for attack or defense..
Its a culture that is not that far removed from Rambo and the spotlight on the knife he had, no reality at all.
If you wanted advise on a practical knife you would consult a Bush man that spends their life living with a knife, I would rather an abattoir worker commend a knife than a "High speed low drag" (whatever that means) Walter Mitty tell me whats good.
It all reflects the "tactical" mentality that these knifes are pushed and sold to.
What does a Tactical Knife mean?
It's a selling tool to a part of a community that soaks it up.

These $5.00 "tools" have killed 10's of thousands more than any Tactical Combat Knife worth $400 dollars

coldsteel_machete_machetes_bolo_light_heavy.jpg
 
Thanks Topher for the explanation, it most certainly does help.

There was never any doubt that the document that failed to load would again appear and read exactly as it had prior, I just wanted to understand why it did not prior.

If it becomes uncontroverted that Duane Dwyer is this Poland guy and is not a super trained sniper there is going to be a few Police SWAT teams unhappy about him being proven to be a Poser and some LE admin types distraught over the liability created by having his Officers trained by a poser.

This thread will probably stay on page one here in GB&U and live a long life as long as the absolute proof one way or another is not posted. I have always been in awe of Duane's background and accomplishments and I have heard his name mentioned before during discussions about SWAT sniper stuff. His alleged real world experiences and "confirmed" kills made him a true Hero and I would love to be able to continue to hold the guy in the highest regard but cannot until I get absolute proof Poland and Dwyer are one and the same

Happy New Year, may you all have a safe and prosperous 2008!!!!
 
711432 said:
While that is the point of threads like these it does not seem to be working.

I doubt there will be anything as comprehensive Spark's outing of Mick, and it was well timed to have an impact right around Blade '07. Yet the Strider table was as busy as any I have ever seen. MSC customs continue to sell out the same day they are posted at places like TAD Gear and Alaska Knives. Dwyer customs perform similarly. And the Strider limited edition non-customs typically have more demand than supply.

Bladeforums is one of, if not the, largest knife related web sites on the planet. Thousands of people visit here each day. Yet, in this thread and its predecessor, the same 10 or 12 people rehash the same circular arguments over and over.

None of this will put Strider out of business regardless of what you all uncover. Post all the long winded diatribes about honor and integrity you want. Type out your marginally metaphorical stories. Most people don't care one way or the other. You obviously want to harm their business and you've failed every time you've tried.
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Hmmmmmmmmm.......

While, IF proven true..... this little fiasco may or may not put them "out of business", as you say.

I do think however, you severly underestimate the power of "word of mouth advertising".

To think that a company.... any company ..... based on a facade of fairy tales and lies stemming from a persona created by it's owners..... will not suffer when the truth comes out..........

....................... is absolutely laughable. :)

You don't really believe that do you ?

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wolfmann601 said:
Thanks Topher for the explanation, it most certainly does help.

If it becomes uncontroverted that Duane Dwyer is this Poland guy and is not a super trained sniper there is going to be a few Police SWAT teams unhappy about him being proven to be a Poser and some LE admin types distraught over the liability created by having his Officers trained by a poser.

Happy New Year, may you all have a safe and prosperous 2008!!!!
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_____________________

Yep.... that could and most probanly will ......get real, real interesting.................
IF indeed it turns out the party in question was a poser without out the real credentials required to instruct, whatever those credentials may be.

Liability can be a very cruel task master if it lands on ones head.

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hardheart said:
And what has generated the demand and influenced customer preference for the Strider knife? Slab-sided and cord-wrapped stainless blades ......................... ................

Why some people like to think military background has a single thing to do with making a good knife in the first place, I can't figure.
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_______________________

Two very good questions, IMO.

They could probably be answered with this.......................

The "persona" created by, and that surrounded; those in question.

Some people are blinded by and flock to the "image"......... whether it is fact based or fiction, they do not care and may never even consider.

Then, when / if the house of cards comes tumbling down; they are left slack jawed.... wondering what happened.

This can and does happen in all walks of life.... not just the knife world.
And don't be too quick to judge, cause it might just happen to me or you too.... in one form or another.

"Persona"......... watch out for it.

Make sure the "real deal" is in fact the ""REAL DEAL""........

............most time the true ""REAL DEAL"", in anything ........... is NOT the one who has to talk about it to convince you......... ;)

He does not have to show you his "Press Clippings" .........

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Just my .02 ...... your mileage may vary....... :)

Have a good one.............
 
RWS said:
Bottom line: I think most people care about posers and liars and until they're willing to come clean about it, most people won't want to do business with them.

Many companies make stoopid mistakes and then own up to those mistakes. They realize that the only way to successfully continue business is to admit wrong doing or admit to their careless or reckless judgment.

Most BODs of public companies with any credibility at all will fire its corporate leader's/executive management team for their slime ball tactics as fast as they can in order to preserve and salvage their company and its reputation as a result of management's unethical behavior, especially of this magnitude....as well they should.

From what I can tell, Strider made a huge mistake lying to people and has never owned up to it (except for the forced lawyer letter admitting to his BS in that lawsuit.)


Enron, Global Crossing, Authur Anderson, Qwest, WorldCom, Adelphia, Xerox all suffered substantial life altering, and unrecoverable financial loss along with tens of thousands of their employees and shareholders due to their unethical, lying BS. So, please for the sake of everyone who has been cornholed by some scumbag businessman BS artist and has lost everything they've worked a lifetime to obtain, don't act like nobody cares about lying, lowlife, self-serving business con men.
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Very well said RWS.... Very well said.....:thumbup:

PS ......... You can bet your rear end I care about dishonest crap ...... no matter what the arena.

The words I made BOLD & LARGE ...in your quoted post above made me very aware.

It shortened my ""learning curve"" a whole lot in the ""School of Real Life"" ............. :)

$$$$$$$$$ down the proverbal drain ......... :)

So yeah, I care........ it seems some people would be surprized at just how many really do care.

Oh, they probably will not be the ones we hear about or from .......... but you can bet your bottom dollar.......... they will be heard from on the bottom line of sleazy companies .... sooner or later.

IMO, of course.

Have a good one.......
 
Will this "outing" affect their business? I was going to purchase a Strider in the very near future. I'll not do so now and will buy another Sebenza instead. I came to this conclusion after reading this thread. The decision is not based upon their false statements having any affect on the value of their product but for the simple fact that I will not support any business or individual who, by purporting to be something they are not denegrates the image of the true heros who have or are serving our country.
 
Richard K said:
Will this "outing" affect their business? I was going to purchase a Strider in the very near future. I'll not do so now and will buy another Sebenza instead. I came to this conclusion after reading this thread. The decision is not based upon their false statements having any affect on the value of their product but for the simple fact that I will not support any business or individual who, by purporting to be something they are not denegrates the image of the true heros who have or are serving our country.
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Welcome to the world of the LOUDLY ethical. As opposed to the quiet just because its the right thing to do group.

We all applaud your brave stand and at such a high personal cost. It takes my breath away.
 
Justabuyer said:
Welcome to the world of the LOUDLY ethical. As opposed to the quiet just because its the right thing to do group.

We all applaud your brave stand and at such a high personal cost. It takes my breath away.
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Well your apparent lack of moral compass and understanding of how business operates takes my breath away. Initially I thought you were just ignorant, but the level of ignorance you've displayed in this thread on a variety of topics is quiite remarkable. I believe it's much more likely that you are just a troll. Good day.
 
Justabuyer said:
Welcome to the world of the LOUDLY ethical. As opposed to the quiet just because its the right thing to do group.

We all applaud your brave stand and at such a high personal cost. It takes my breath away.
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You know what? I've had enough of your trolling.

You lost the right to comment on "loudly ethical" right here:

Justabuyer said:
What bothers me is I own dozens of Strider knives and I am a paying customer here. This kind of post de-values my assets and nobody but Strider knife owners are punished.

Why is this tolerated? What have I done to Spark and bubba to deserve this kind of treatment? :grumpy: Not kidding either. My Strider customs either wont sell at all or go for hundreds less that before all this. Me and people like me are the only losers here. WHY IS THIS ALLOWED TO CONTINUE?
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From that point on, you've done nothing but show a remarkable double standards for "ethics."

If you want to talk about "quietly doing the right thing" then you need to start living it, because this thread is rife with examples to the contrary.
 
Justabuyer said:
Welcome to the world of the LOUDLY ethical. As opposed to the quiet just because its the right thing to do group.

We all applaud your brave stand and at such a high personal cost. It takes my breath away.
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Justabuyer, your use of the words "We all" above is beyond your authority. I, for one, applaud Richard K's view and subscribe to it myself. I dare say no more than five others posting here are in your minority. Is there a chance you could just state facts, or even your well thought out opinion without the sarcasm and cynicism?

To all, I don't think all this, even if proven true, will have much impact on the Strider Knives business as "groupie think" is very strong for them. However, if Mr. Dwyer is found to be this "Poland" fellow, I would find it unusual if any respectable organization or entity were to invite him to train them at anything. I don't think it is Strider Knives that needs to be worried but his business as a trainer (again, if proved true).

Once you remove the "rock star" mentality I find little to recommend their knives anyway. For those of us who have carried combat knives for a living, they have a few features I would find disagreeable in the field. For one, cord wrapped handles do not conform to the shape of the inside of the hand so are not very comfortable in hard use. Also, the cords tend to soak up DEET, fuel, water, or any other liquid. The shape of their guards have lots of hard, sharp angles. Your hands, and other parts of your body, will find these abrupt angles when you least need to. They hurt. There are many more knives I've owned and carried that seem to me to be more functional and ergonomic (CRK, Randalls, Entrek, etc.). I wonder what percentage of the combat type knives they sell ever get used for their purpose. I presume most never do because the majority that buy them will never be ready to go in harm's way.
 
Justabuyer said:
Welcome to the world of the LOUDLY ethical. As opposed to the quiet just because its the right thing to do group.

We all applaud your brave stand and at such a high personal cost. It takes my breath away.
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To breathless: I seriously doubt that my decision to not enhance my meager collection with a Strider will have any effect on the value of your Striders and I'm sure it will not have any effect on their overall business success. Your concept of ethics and morality are based strictly upon monetary considerations and the value of your collection. Furthermore, I will decline to waste my common sense on someone who has been educated beyond their intelligence. Enjoy your Striders.
 
And as for 711432, I was wonder how long it would take for a "new user" to register and have a "hidden understanding of what's really going on" here. (Note: sarcasm)

Throughout this entire fiasco, I haven't said word one negative about Strider Knives. So let me put this in crystal clear focus for you: I don't have any ill will towards the company, nor do I wish them any harm. I hope that they sell every knife they make. Personally I think Mick Strider & Duane Dwyer are great knife designers, and that their designs are very simple & effective.

Finally, if you think I outed this, or am responsible for any difficulties, real or imagined, you need to think again. The responsibility for this entire ball of wax lays on two people's shoulders - if you can't handle being called on tall tales, don't tell them. Furthermore, no one would have known anything about this had Mick Strider not been sued & forced to admit his background wasn't what he claimed 2 years ago.

So get this straight - I didn't start this thread:
http://www.tacticalforums.com/cgi-bin/tacticalubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=000514

Nor this one:
http://www.tacticalforums.com/cgi-bin/tacticalubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=000555

I didn't start this thread either (Cold Steel Strider ripoff):
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=450456

Or this one ("Lick my sack!"
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=367175

Or this (Cold Steel vs. Strider):
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=467140

Or this (Strider, what is the real history)
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=452544

I didn't tell the groupies to throw Buck under the bus:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3789932

Or get people to ask those "uncomfortable" questions:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=464680

I didn't restart the flame wars:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=457239

Or even when given a massive opportunity to "harm", I did this:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=272609
(note my MASSIVE WANTING TO DO HARM TO STRIDER KNIVES in that thread) (Note: Sarcasm)

Or any of a bunch of other threads, including the tall tale ones.

The only thread I did start was this:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=453852 which was in response to yet another Strider Controversy. The difference was that I was able to recognize BS when I read it, and was willing to research it to see if the other stories bore fruit.

Strider controversy was going on all over long before I put his lies into an easy to read format. Most of that controversy was, surprise, self inflicted. It'll go on as long as people ask those "uncomfortable" questions, or people don't put their past behind them.

So, when you say that my intent is to harm Strider Knives, you couldn't be more wrong. If my intent was to harm their sales, I could easily set the word filter on this site to replace every instance of "Strider" with a link to the POWNetwork pages. If I was going to do harm, I'd take out advertisements in various magazines about this disgusting affair. I'd set up a Wikipedia page detailing this whole mess, or publicize this mess as much as possible, instead of hiding this in a (relatively small) subforum.

I've had my say. The points I made stand up, and despite all the scapegoating, shooting the messenger, and other character assassination on the part of people like yourself, nothing really changes.

In summation, nice try. You are going to have to look for another candidate to blame for the actions of Mick & Duane.
 
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