When it's not exactly Made in the USA - Hoback

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Did you watch the video? He knew his knives were being sold as made in America and never did anything about that. So he knowingly sold knives made overseas as USA made.
I did watch the video -- did you? Because you don't sound like you really heard what he was saying. He said that he contacted A dealer several times. He admitted that he didn't do enough to police dealers' descriptions.

Why are y'all giving the dealers a total pass for posting false information that Hoback did NOT provide them? To me, if anyone's at fault here it is the dealers who posted phony COAs that they seemingly pulled out of their asses.
 
Now, if it were me and someone (in this case all of the largest knife dealers on the friggin’ internet) were misrepresenting my product, the video I’d be uploading to my social media would be VERY different. I certainly wouldn’t be apologizing, that’s for sure. “Folks, these companies telling you my knives were made in America (which I have profited from handsomely for the past several years) all owe you an apology!”
 
Show me where he claims that all of his knives are made in America, because I'm not going to be able to prove a negative.
I'm simply saying that you can't offer something you heard him say as proof.

He can testify as to what he has said. Those who have spoken with him can testify as to what was said. Any documents can be examined for whatever light they may shed upon the matter.

But you, as a third party, keep arguing that something you heard from someone else is proof of its veracity. It doesn't work that way.

In a civil trial, it would be determined by the preponderance of the evidence. I have a feeling it's tilting in one direction more than another, based upon culpable statements by the man himself...and statements of folks he's done business with.

You and I can only make reasonable assumptions based upon that information. No more, no less...absent concrete evidence.
 
I did watch the video -- did you? Because you don't sound like you really heard what he was saying. He said that he contacted A dealer several times. He admitted that he didn't do enough to police dealers' descriptions.

Why are y'all giving the dealers a total pass for posting false information that Hoback did NOT provide them? To me, if anyone's at fault here it is the dealers who posted phony COAs that they seemingly pulled out of their asses.
Is this Jake hoback?
 
I don't own a Hoback, but apparently there's a lot of people that do like his designs and knives. Quality of materials? Is it just the USA label? What if his ridiculous prices dropped down to say $200-$300 and be in the same category as other knives with Chinese labels?
Then no problem. It's not that complicated.
 
I’d prefer my 1911 to be 100% USA made, but I’ll take high quality forgings from a reputable manufacturer in Brazil over chinesium stuff any day of the week.
I have enjoyed this thread and really have nothing of importance to add other than to point out that you can and should have your 1911 made in the USA

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I did watch the video -- did you? Because you don't sound like you really heard what he was saying. He said that he contacted A dealer several times. He admitted that he didn't do enough to police dealers' descriptions.

Why are y'all giving the dealers a total pass for posting false information that Hoback did NOT provide them? To me, if anyone's at fault here it is the dealers who posted phony COAs that they seemingly pulled out of their asses.
Did you miss the part where he said he makes some knives in the US and the exact same knives outside of the US?

Or how about the part he just didn't know what to do, poor him, feed his family, and forgive him?
 
I don't think every manufacturer is. I know of one at least that refuses to say who their OEM is.
Larger American and international companies don't like saying who their OEM is, but small shops and custom shops have no choice. They can either tell us if and who they're partnering with, respectfully to both us buyers and their foreign teammates, or there's a limit to how many kinds of parts they can order elsewhere.

Screws in a knife with scale and blades turned from raw material into finished goods in house? That's not gonna bother anyone, but if the the blades are coming as 85% complete 'blanks' that just need edges and finishes applied, and the scales are entirely machined elsewhere, then those knives better be priced and identified accordingly. That's not the same as small batch domestic production and shouldn't be passed off as such.
 
3D Anvil 3D Anvil Check this out. It's time to lay down some logic.


"Occasionally, we are asked where our products are made… While everything is designed by me, personally, and everything we sell comes through or directly from our shop, not everything is 100% made in America. We seek to use the best the world has to offer to make some of the best tools on earth, and sometimes that means we must draw upon global sources – often because domestic sources are unavailable, of poor quality, or are cost prohibitive. We do not disclose the specific names of the companies we source from and/or work with or the countries in which they are located, but we will always commit to producing a superior-quality product at a good price – along with a great warranty and exceptional customer service!"

It's already been covered in previous pages that this current language was updated to this state in order to reflect more of the reality, since the discovery has been made that he does in fact make complete knives elsewhere (per his admission in his video). I think this makes it clear that he does indeed make some knives here, and again, he said as much when he said in his video Kmikaz3 Kmikaz3 kindly posted, and I quote: "We make stuff in the United States, we make a lot of stuff in the United States..." at 3:26 in the vid. There it is, full stop. Some of his "stuff" is made here. So, that should put your earlier repeated attempts at playing some BS semantics game to rest.

Here's where I, and a bunch of others immediately have a problem, at 3:40 where he says "...I outsource. I've always done that...*" and "There are some times where we're making knives in our shop while simultaneously working outside of the US with the exact same parts..."

Hole up, bruh. If that's the case, Jake, did you think to put any indicator at all of this on your packaging? You know, that thing you have total control of? How about the Birth Card? Just "couldn't figure it out"? I don't even work there, and I figured out how to sort this issue out in roughly a quarter of a second.

Further, watching back through this video, I'm not sure how you can really take his side for the "misunderstanding" because he basically tried to lay this all at the feet of the Dealers (as in, all of them). "Well, they put "Made in America" and I "tried to correct them", and then suddenly everyone else was saying it." Then he makes it seem like there was some huge inability to correct everyone and sort it all out, like he was just "unable" to do so. Really? If I were a maker, and my products were being misconstrued at all of the Internet Dealers**, immediately, I'd have been on the phone with them all to get that sorted out. At the very least, I'd have added a giant splash page (again, immediately) on my website saying something to the tune of "Ok guys, all the dealers are saying my knives are Made in the US, that's not completely true, here's a list of all my models that are made overseas. Sorry about that, but appreciate your continued business." Instead, what seems most likely to have happened is that all of a sudden, people were buying all the knives he could make (and have made), and huh, with all this money rolling in, suddenly, it didn't seem that important, so I guess he gets to take "extreme ownership" of that, kind of like he took "extreme ownership" of all the money being generated by all the people who were happy to pay $600+ for knives they thought were made here.

BUT. Ok. Let's say that for some reason, this whole deception is the dealers' fault. They wanted to put "Made in the US: in the description for his knives, and try as he might, he just could not get them to go back on that. Ok, let's take that at face value (LOL) for a second. Rut row, another bonus question: who packages his knives? Is it DLT Trading? SMKW? BladeHQ? Does he just send them a big bag full of loose knives, and those dealers create those pretty wooden boxes for him? Do they print those birth cards for him? No? Odd. I mean, if HE and his company were responsible for shipping the orders to these dealer clients, that means he's got control of the packaging, which means he could have put the country of origin on the damn boxes at any time. Or, he could put it on the "Birth cards" they come with. "Proudly Made in China".

But he apparently hasn't. Why was that? Oh...oh, right. Because it was easier to just go along with it, once he started seeing the money rolling in from dealers and collectors who thought they were all buying an overbuilt, American made knife. Yeah, I know, I know, Chinese knives are reaching new heights of popularity these days, but the fact remains that things like country of origin start to matter to people spending what BlowBack knives cost. It's as simple as that. So, you and the other guy trying to make this out to be some double-standards nonsense are just wrong. Every time it's discovered that some other "maker" is selling knives made in China, but labeling them as US made, that maker gets outed and roasted into oblivion. Remember Jared West? Of QTRMSTR fame? That dude runs a carwash these days, because literally everyone stopped buying his knives after the deception was made super public here and elsewhere.

So, for the last time, this isn't about where screws are made, it's where knives are being made, and people aren't told about them. Simple as that.


* Which means this is even more concerning, because he admits he's been doing this since the beginning. I wonder how many people are walking around with these outsourced knives, thinking all this time they were made here?

** I remind you that we're talking about the biggest dealers in the country, not a few Mom & Pop places that just accidentally added this descriptor.
 
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