Another Paypal Discussion

Pellel2 said:
You guys should show your wives this thread and see what reaction they have hahaha I bet they will have the same as mine lol
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Maria is one of five County Prosecutors. She calls the forum my little pocket knife club. She's been Mrs Greykilt 35 + years and has gotten used to folders and daggers and slip joints falling out of my laundry basket years ago. She is well aware of my insanity. She expects the same from my peers. And you guys have never ever failed to disappoint....:) But she doesn't think " BF should have to monitor an entity they have no vested interest in". ....Just sayin'. Course it only took her 30 seconds to deduce that, not 3 days and 141 + posts.
 
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This thread really didn't need to go any further than, If they're asking for payment via gift, "net to me", or add __%, just close the ad and keep scrolling.
It's a petty technicality; but if I want it, I'll pay a $550 asking price...but I won't agree to adding 3% (or 4, or 5) to a stated price of $525 to cover fees.

Disagreeing with sending payment as a gift really has nothing to with defending PayPal (and their fees); I don't know why some people can't (or choose not to) fathom that...but nothing anybody says is going to make the little light turn on for them. Especially for the ones that ask If it's so wrong, why is it an option?

Unsubscribed; but thankful I've noted a few people to avoid on The Exchange.
 
Greykilt said:
Maria is one of five County Prosecutors. She calls the forum my little pocket knife club. She's been Mrs Greykilt 35 + years and has gotten used to folders and daggers and slip joints falling out of my laundry basket years ago. She is well aware of my insanity. She expects the same from my peers. And you guys have never ever failed to disappoint....:) But she doesn't think " BF should have to monitor an entity they have no vested interest in". ....Just sayin'. Course it only took her 30 seconds to deduce that, not 3 days and 141 + posts.
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All we need is a disclaimer stating that if you use the service not as intended in their ToS, you do so and run so at your own risk. Bladeforums is not liable in any way after that.
 
145.... PayPal is owned by Ebay. Ebay is worth $65 BILLION as of May 2013 and I'm sure a few billion dollars more today (Ebay is trading @ 57.84 a share today) They also own "BILL ME LATER", I'm sure they aren't collecting interest from half the membership every month. I know its still dishonest and I will continue to pay the fees. Lets continue to worry about PayPal?
 
Summary:
Go out and get a nice 750 ml bottle of Jim Beam AND a couple of Jarbenzas AND add up the total you spent. Calc out 4.6% and put that amount in an envelope. Put it all in a box THEN write GIFT on it and send it to..........Colorado c/o Greykilt
 
Greykilt said:
Words from my good friend, Professional Knifemaker James Terrio and one of many reasons why I purcahase knives from him.
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Every buyer is uncomfortable the first few times around, as am I as a seller. Still, I have frequently send my knives out before getting payment. Am I talking $500-1000 blades? No.I don't dare. But if a guy who messes himself up for a $300 blade is a fool. It hasn't happened yet. I also have suppliers who send me products before payment. Here's the thing. Fools, idiots ,and cheats will willow themselves out.
 
Okay David here's what ya do...go get a nice 750 ml bottle of blah blah blah...a $1500 Stifle Special Slicer...blah blah...writ GIFT on the.....
 
RecalcitrantAmerican said:
Thanks Grey for the clarification on my point, thats exactly what I meant. Here is the MILLION DOLLAR QUESTION!!!! "IF THE GIFT TAB IS SO WRONG, THEN WHY DOES PAYPAL GIVE US THE OPTION OF USING IT IN THE FIRST PLACE?"
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The gift tab is not inherently wrong. Using the gift tab to send money to a friend or family member because they're short on cash is perfectly legit. Parents can send money to their college kids without fees being taken out. People can donate money to a charity without the charity incurring fees. It is the abuse of the gift tab by using it for something it is not intended for that is a violation of an agreement you have with a business. That is the problem.

I won't play that game with folks who insist on Gift. If they expect me to forfeit my protection so they can jilt PayPal out of a few bucks or so they can feel safer, then too bad. No deal. Nor do I ever expect payment by gift when selling. I prefer USPS Money Order when selling anyway. PayPal doesn't get their fee, it's same as cash for me, and the buyer is protected by federal mail fraud laws.
 
Greykilt said:
Okay David here's what ya do...go get a nice 750 ml bottle of blah blah blah...a $1500 Stifle Special Slicer...blah blah...writ GIFT on the.....
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I've never been taken yet, Bill. I don't do it often, just saying I have. Guess you have to know who you're dealing with, and i usually do.
 
Lying is lying is lying. It doesn't matter who you're lying to, or why you're doing it, it doesn't change what your doing. Paypal makes billions of dollars and your sale would have given them three. The money you would have been required to give them is for all practical purposes 0% of their yearly, hell, their daily business, so what? Does that magically make you breaking a business deal, lying, or stealing okay? How about stealing a candy bar from a WalMart, is that okay? I mean WalMart isn't going to hurt over or likely even notice a missing Snickers so that makes it okay to snag one right? Where do you draw the line? It goes far beyond defending Paypal, it's a matter of your integrity, which to some is apparently worth less than the price of a couple of hamburgers. Here's the big deal, the image of the community is damaged by weekly, sometimes daily threads about someone getting burnt and more often than not it's on a deal using Paypal's gift option. It's not always one-off scammers that these threads are about either; it's been long time members with pretty good feedback plenty of times. So maybe we can see now why people are so annoyed by this and why so many want this gift BS to stop, I doubt it though.

Is making a new rule the right call? What's the point, no one reads them anyway. How many people in this thread can honestly say they took the time to read the rules before they started posting? I didn't, I read them quite a bit later. How many have actually gave them a glance at all?
 
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You are absolutely correct sir. Lying is lying. People who make many trades, sells, and buys are more often then not the ones who are going to run into issues as opposed to members with little to zero transactions due to the law of averages. By the way no one is taking money away from paypal. I've never sold a knife and magically had extra money end up in my acct. The "gift" button between family and friends doesn't take money from PayPal's net worth. If they did not want the "Gift" transaction to available they would not offer it. I personally pay PayPals fee, but calling members thieves is not fair. Choosing not to deal with "Gifters" is your right, as it is mine. Just simply ignore them. If I see "Gift" only I'll pm to see if they are serious. If they are I move on to the next deal down the road, buy I don't call the liar. (Honestly with no disrespect it is a lil sharp, especially for a member with ONE transaction as long as you've been here. :o But you are entitled to your opinion Sir.)
 
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LEGION 12 said:
I Will never deal with anyone asking for payment via gift or asking for me to pay Their fees . Wont buy , sell or trade with them just keep adding them to my ignore list. If everyone did the same things would be a lot better in the exchange and this forum as a whole. It's obviously not ever going to be in the rules here so it up to you.
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Esav Benyamin said:
If you are going to ignore ads asking for gift or fees, you will have a much greater impact if you tell them why you passed over their sale. The more who do so, the more impact. Just not buying could mean you didn't like the knife.

If you do like the knife and the price, but won't support a scam payment request, tell them. Don't tell them in the ad, that's interfering. Send them a Visitor Message, so everyone else can see you sent it too. That's feedback!
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wjswiger said:
I completely agree with this. I've done this....not in visitor but in PM.....and I've gotten no end of crap from each seller I've contacted!! I've always been respectful but clear in my reason for not dealing with them and they've....to a man....told me to do anatomically impolite acts!!
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David Stifle said:
I've never been taken yet, Bill. I don't do it often, just saying I have. Guess you have to know who you're dealing with, and i usually do.
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GWashington1732 said:
Lying is lying is lying. It doesn't matter who you're lying to, or why you're doing it, it doesn't change what your doing. Paypal makes billions of dollars and your sale would have given them three. The money you would have been required to give them is for all practical purposes 0% of their yearly, hell, their daily business, so what? Does that magically make you breaking a business deal, lying, or stealing okay? How about stealing a candy bar from a WalMart, is that okay? I mean WalMart isn't going to hurt over or likely even notice a missing Snickers so that makes it okay to snag one right? Where do you draw the line? It goes far beyond defending Paypal, it's a matter of your integrity, which to some is apparently worth less than the price of a couple of hamburgers. Here's the big deal, the image of the community is damaged by weekly, sometimes daily threads about someone getting burnt and more often than not it's on a deal using Paypal's gift option. It's not always one-off scammers that these threads are about either; it's been long time members with pretty good feedback plenty of times. So maybe we can see now why people are so annoyed by this and why so many want this gift BS to stop, I doubt it though.

Is making a new rule the right call? What's the point, no one reads them anyway. How many people in this thread can honestly say they took the time to read the rules before they started posting? I didn't, I read them quite a bit later. How many have actually gave them a glance at all?
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The dilemma of righteous indignation...
To Gift
Or Not to gift.....
That is the question........
Or is it now the Rule?
And who maintains that Rule?
Who doth hold the Sacred Rule Book?
And Will Our New And Improved Book Of Rules Really Change The World?
Not if it doesn't begin within each of us. For every rule posted there is some dear soul who, with serious intent and well meaning demeanor, discovers a way to circumvent it. Each and every Rule, each and every Time.
PayPal could simply charge a fee for EVERY transaction and then Viola' We'd have nothing to talk about would we? But since they do not then how is it NOW Blade Forums duty to police that, to enforce that, among ourselves?
If you start this effort to clean up the business world one post at a time, then I truly wish you all the power God (or any other righteous entity you hold sacred) can give you. Especially when it is such a simple fix.
Again, if you don't like the sellers terms, don't buy the seller's product. And Then We're Done...

Or are we?

Isn't that enough?
No, you say,
We need to control not only What you do but also how you Feel about doing it.
Really?
 
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but I just want a Jarbenza and Tommy is selling it for a dollar and they're Two dollars everywhere else but he wants me to gift him cause the fees are too high and he don't want to pay em and I don't want to pay em so now what?...

Send Tommy a line. Tell him you want the Jarbenza. Tell him you will purchase a US Postal Money Order for the sale price. Tell him you'll send him that. Tell him you are going to Copy the Money Order and Post the Copy before you send it. Tell him when he goes to the Post Office he can cash that Money Order right there at the service counter.

but if I do that then I don't have any protection in case, in case, in case something goes wrong and I'm dissatisfied

You don't have any protection against dissatisfaction the moment you choose 'Gift' as an option. Ask Tommy to send you the knife C.O.D. and after you inspect it, you will send him the Post Office Money Oder,

but he says that is a tremendous leap of faith on his part

...uhm,...WTF?
 
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